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Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

lensrentals.com

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Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#131

Post by amluto »

4ad wrote: post #82
lostlogin wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A thread higher up discusses the damage being related to the aperture size - phones have a tiny aperture.

Not really, the light flux is not really related to the physical aperture (diameter of the lens), but rather to the f-number of the lens (what photographers usually call "aperture" is in fact the f-number, focal length divided by lens aperture), an iPhone has an f/1.7 lens. This is an extremely fast lens, faster than any any zoom on a DSLR. Only dedicated prime lenses are faster. The flux is: Φ/4α² * 1/A² Total energ…

This is just theoretical pontification, but I think there is a respect in which size matters: heat dissipation. Suppose you have a sensor laminated to a heat sink. If you apply some flux density (power per unit area) to a very small area (as would happen with a phone camera), you can dissipate heat in three dimensions: back toward the heat sink and to the sides through the rest of the sensor. If, in contrast, you apply the same flux density to a large area, the edge effects matter less and you approach the limit where heat only dissipates straight back. This could have a dramatic effect on the temperature.

A similar effect happens in the kitchen. It's very easy to burn yourself by touching a large hot surface, but it's much harder to burn yourself by touching a hot pointy thing.

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#132

Post by hug »

tedunangst wrote: post #37
csomar wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And of the things returned, we were equally impressed with our customer-base, and their guilt and owning up to the damage. I thought the renters would be paying for it?

They still probably lose out on some revenue until a replacement is in stock. Having a working lens is always better for business than getting reimbursed to buy a replacement lens. (That's the nature of the business, though.)

LensRentals do all possible repairs internally, so I suspect that the downtime on an expensive lens like that is minimal if possible. Roger mentioned on the photography subreddit that the aperture replacement was a $200 part and 3 to 4 hours -- it only took so long because it was that tech's first time replacing that part.

https://www.reddit.com/r/photography/comments/6xg8a7/lens_re...

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#133

Post by ars »

wlesieutre wrote: post #122
dingaling wrote: post #6

It's a shame that Lens Rentals had to suffer such material loss, but that report is absolute gold-plated first-hand evidence for my perennial debates with other photographers who insist that they don't need Solar protection for eclipses. "But I took a landscape shot at midday with the Sun in frame and it didn't melt my sensor". The difference being the length of exposure and the concentrations of energy.

Worth noting that on the 600mm with melted iris, the user did use a solar filter. Unfortunately for the lens, the 600mm lens's drop-in filter slot is behind the iris. So the camera was fine, the lens not so much. http://shuttermuse.com/canon-drop-in-filter-guide/

Why do they even make a drop in filter rated for the sun, if it's going to damage the lens?

What use could you make of this filter?

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#134

Post by hug »

Buge wrote: post #114
jonknee wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can torch your sensor in seconds: https://youtu.be/2TO_yZDxryQ

I wonder if that guy damaged his lens while making that. That lens looks similar to one of the damaged ones in the article.

To satisfy your curiosity, he did not. The lens was borrowed from his workplace (a camera store) for the purpose of the video, and was returned unharmed.

The creator of that video hangs around on /r/photography, his comment is here: https://www.reddit.com/r/photography/comments/6xg8a7/lens_re...

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#136

Post by ars »

nxc18 wrote: post #42

I think my favorite part of this article is how the author is so understanding and positive about his users. I think if I had rented out cameras to people, told them not to point it at the eclipse, and then got a bunch of damaged cameras back, I'd be pissed. In fact, I might have choice words for those customers. I think there's a lesson here in targeting inexperienced consumers. Perhaps a good preventative measure w…

> .... I'd be pissed .... choice words for those customers.

Then clearly this is the wrong business for you.

Dealing with stupid customers simply comes with the territory.

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#137

Post by Hannah7777 »

oliwarner wrote: post #80
dingaling wrote: post #6

It's a shame that Lens Rentals had to suffer such material loss, but that report is absolute gold-plated first-hand evidence for my perennial debates with other photographers who insist that they don't need Solar protection for eclipses. "But I took a landscape shot at midday with the Sun in frame and it didn't melt my sensor". The difference being the length of exposure and the concentrations of energy.

When you hire a lens, you're contractually and personally on the hook for anything not insured. So yes, somebody owes LR a considerable amount of money for repairing or replacing that £11,000 600mm lens. The admin of dealing with this crap is built into the rental price. A well looked after lens doesn't depreciate fast.

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Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#138

Post by nickrio »

nolok wrote: post #118
mikeash wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There kind of is, because it's darker when the sun is partially covered, so you'll use a larger aperture or longer exposure than you would normally. This is also why it's more dangerous to look at the sun during an eclipse than it is normally: your iris opens wider during an eclipse because it's not as bright.

I think you misunderstood his point, which was: there is no more energy coming from the sun at any given point during the eclipse than in a clear day. The sun isn't "sending" more energy on the path that aren't blocked, nor is the energy blocked going around the obstacle and concentrating on the areas still visibles. The reason for the damage is entirely due to the receiver behaving/being differently, be it your eyes…

> because they get tricked into thinking it's dark and they act like it

This is a really bad example :DDD

I don't think that is totally true for human eye. You can test it by putting a LED spotlight in front of you at night, and have someone else check your pupil before and after you turn on the LED (And remember test it in different distances).

Camera works differently, they have multiple ways (Metering Modes) to test the brightness of a scene. So how it work will depends on the selected Metering Mode.

And camera can collect more light by letting light keep entering the light sensor for longer time. Plus, bigger lens can also collect more light, some people may even mount their camera on a telescope, thus more light entering. So maybe this is the physical reason why so many gears got destroyed?

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#139

Post by Stratoscope »

howlgram wrote: post #125
nolok wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you misunderstood his point, which was: there is no more energy coming from the sun at any given point during the eclipse than in a clear day. The sun isn't "sending" more energy on the path that aren't blocked, nor is the energy blocked going around the obstacle and concentrating on the areas still visibles. The reason for the damage is entirely due to the receiver behaving/being differently, be it your eyes…

"tricked into thinking it's dark" is kind of misleading, because it is in fact darker, but for some reason unknown to me there the energy from the sun harms you as much. I thought the issue with looking at its sun was its brightness, but i guess it isn't?

During a partial eclipse, part of the sun is hidden behind the moon. So the overall amount of light reaching the ground around you is indeed less, in direct proportion to the amount of sun that is eclipsed.

For example, if 90% of the sun is covered by the moon, then only 10% of the usual amount of sunlight will light up the area around you. So it is quite a bit darker than usual.

However, the portion of the sun that is still visible is just as bright as it would be on any other similar day. If you stare at that remaining portion of the sun, or aim a camera at it, it will cause the same damage as it would any other time, only in a smaller crescent-shaped area instead of a full circle.

The danger to your eyes is even greater, because the overall darkness tricks your irises into opening up wider and letting even more light in than usual.

You're pretty unlikely to stare at the sun for 30 seconds on a normal day. But people do that during a partial eclipse, and that's the problem. Similarly, people don't usually aim their cameras directly at the sun with the lens wide open and no solar filter - except during an eclipse.

A total eclipse is quite a different thing, of course. During totality, the sun's bright photosphere is completely hidden, and only the much fainter corona is visible. This is only about as bright as a full moon, and it's perfectly safe to take pictures with any lens, and to observe directly with the naked eye - even with binoculars.

Re: Rental camera gear destroyed by the 2017 eclipse

#140

Post by basicplus2 »

It is not just at the focal point but

multilayered lenses can be destroyed as the expand and contract and heat is emminated from the join and also

Any lense with coatings to correct for chromatic abberation, the coatings get destroyed on the surface of the lenses just by being pointed at the sun.

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