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Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

gizmodo.co.uk

131–140 of 154 posts

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#131
post #4

A few anecdotes doesn't count as evidence. I voted for Remain, and hope very much that the Brexit process collapses and we end up staying in the EU. But I also don't want to spend the next 2 years being drip-fed poor quality articles about how we're going to hell in a handbasket.

Agreed, we need data, not just anecdotes.

That said, I imagine a lot of skilled workers are going to reason differently than you and leave.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Britain's biggest buy-to-let landlord bans 'coloured people' because of 'the curry smell' [1] how is this even legal in UK. 1. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/29/britains-biggest-...

Although this particular instance is distasteful, as a general rule do you not think individuals should be free to choose who to rent their properties to? What's the alternative; forcing him to accept tenants he doesn't want?

In the United States yes that is one of the consequences of running a business. In the states you legally cannot deny service on the basis of any protected class. Protected classes include Race, Color, Religion, National Origin, Age (40+), Sex, Pregnancy, Citizenship, Familial Status, Disability Status, Veteran status, and Genetic information. This is because forcing him to accept tenants he doesn't want is a much smaller injustice than people being unable to get serviced because of something they cannot help. I hope this helps you understand that nobody's rights are more important than anyone else's.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Next thing you'll be criticising laws against employer discrimination. If someone wants an all white company, what's wrong with that? You want to force employers to hire people they don't want?

Not sure if your analogy is correct. If someone wants an all white company is discrimination. But if someone wants swedish speaking people and they all happen to be white it's no longer a problem. Same with the tenants. I might prefer to rent my property to a woman because she takes care of the place better and is less likely to throw a party. Is that a discrimination? Point is if there's an objective reason behind i…

Actually in the states that can still be discrimination and you can still be charged. Obviously it would be judged by a jury of your peers, however people have been successfully charged with discrimination in the states even when they defended themselves with your exact argument. Ethical concerns aside your advice is extremely legally dangerous.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#134
post #10

I'm one of the soon-to-be-expat Brits. Like Herr Pierzina, I'm also troubled by the IP Act. Moving is really not fun, but move I must: the IP Act is unconscionable in many parts, and Brexit takes away one of the few powers that could fight those parts. Two Home Secretaries in a row that just don't get encryption. My time is split between finishing my novel, learning German, and trying to catch up on tech that came ou…

> My time is split between finishing my novel, learning German, and trying to catch up on tech that came out while I was writing.

Thanks for sharing!

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if your analogy is correct. If someone wants an all white company is discrimination. But if someone wants swedish speaking people and they all happen to be white it's no longer a problem. Same with the tenants. I might prefer to rent my property to a woman because she takes care of the place better and is less likely to throw a party. Is that a discrimination? Point is if there's an objective reason behind i…

Actually in the states that can still be discrimination and you can still be charged. Obviously it would be judged by a jury of your peers, however people have been successfully charged with discrimination in the states even when they defended themselves with your exact argument. Ethical concerns aside your advice is extremely legally dangerous.

Yes, I fully understand your point and I don't think anyone will take my comment as an advice, it's just my opinion.

The problem is quite complex and hard to solve in one shot.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#136
No one think of it in another way: they were originally talents in their home country and it is actually the recovery of the "Brain-Drain" of their home country...

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#137
post #60
post #48

After Brexit everyone in Zurich thought that all FinTech startups would move from London to Frankfurt or maybe Zurich, since Switzerland has tight relationships with the EU. This did not seem to happen. Also, I haven't gotten more UK people asking me for tech jobs in Zurich compared to before Brexit. (I run a tech recruiting agency; happy to help people who want to move to Switzerland, you finde the recently released…

Your ability to connect any recruitment related article discussing something local for anywhere in the world to your recruiting agency in Zurich is impressive:) I don't normally recognize people on HN without looking at the nickname but I know it's you all the time :)

Thank you! I honestly primarily try to add value.

Some people moved because of these posts, so I hope my outreach has a positive net impact on the HN community.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#138
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surely this is a victory for Poland?

That depends, are there companies in Poland that can make good use of his specific skills? You cannot ignore the effects of matching people with the jobs where they are most productive. People moving between countries is not a zero sum game.

A lot has changed in Poland trough past couple years especially for developers. You can now get decent salary in major cities. It's still not as good as in UK where you can have decent salary in cities with population of 30k+ but it's getting there, plus there is always Germany witch is close enough.

Quick story. I am working for small UK holidays company located in one of the biggest IT hubs outside of London. Our whole dev team is made up from non UK, EU citizens. Recently we had openings for mid backend dev and junior/mid frontend dev roles and only about 20% of CVs was from native UK citizens (mostly, highly under qualified even for junior role/couldn't pass FizzBuzz). Rest of candidates was mix of EU, visas and double citizenship and we ended up offering both positions to two EU citizens.

If UK government will ban employment of people from outside of UK or make it difficult or expensive then small companies like ours will not be able to operate.

I see that developers are looking more and more for jobs outside of the UK. Recruiters and EU employers also can see what is going on and I'm receiving more job offers from them, offering help with relocation outside of UK.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although this particular instance is distasteful, as a general rule do you not think individuals should be free to choose who to rent their properties to? What's the alternative; forcing him to accept tenants he doesn't want?

In the United States yes that is one of the consequences of running a business. In the states you legally cannot deny service on the basis of any protected class. Protected classes include Race, Color, Religion, National Origin, Age (40+), Sex, Pregnancy, Citizenship, Familial Status, Disability Status, Veteran status, and Genetic information. This is because forcing him to accept tenants he doesn't want is a much sm…

That sounds like an enormous oversimplification of what, I imagine, is an extremely complex area of the law.

In the case of prospective tenants, I assume a fair degree of self-incrimination would be required to prove discrimination based on a protected characteristic.

To the point about some people's rights being "more important" than others', rights are a zero-sum game.

Giving protected classes a right to service from businesses necessarily comes at the cost of business owners' rights to refuse service.

The law is necessarily concerned with determine whose rights are "more important" in these cases.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#140

I know at least one programmer who is leaving the UK because of Brexit. Personally I am staying put and assuming things will work out ok.

I think Brexit is probably the best decision Britain has made since WWII second only to electing Thatcher.

I would have imagined that techies would appreciate this the most. The E.U is a bureaucratic, insatiable behemoth. Too many regulations and I would like to think that this is something techies have a great disdain for. I mean, just look at how unfairly the E.U has treated co.s like Google, Microsoft and Uber - these companies have deliberately been attacked by the E.U using antitrust laws among other regulations.

How has this helped the situation? I'd say, in no way. Stopping American companies from thriving in the E.U won't help the situation. Instead, learning from previous mistakes and correctly anticipating/predicting the next wave would be greatly rewarded by market forces and this would be the best thing for individual, sovereign European countries.

Please watch this video about the insane E.U laws I've mentioned: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44YTTyQKyJQ

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