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ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
131–140 of 142 posts
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#132LOAN TESTIMONY OF HOW I GOT LOAN FROM A LEGITIMATE MONEY LENDER
Hello Everyone, My names are Johnson Smith, i am from the United States of America, currently living in Texas city.i went in search for a loan on the internet , and the Lord lead me to a genuine loan lender, A Company of Fidelity Loan FInance. fidelityloanfinancial(AT)gmail(DOT)com, whom i contacted and requested for a loan amount of $45,000.00 dollars to establish a new business, and to my surprise i got my desired loan within 2 days(48 hours). While searching for a company to get a loan from, i read various testimonies of how people where scammed of their money,and i was scared.I am happy i came in contact with FIDELITY LOAN FINANCE.so i humbly advice you in search of a genuine loan lender to quickly contact FIDELITY LOAN FINANCE via email:fidelityloanfinancial(AT)gmail(DOT)com or website on www(DOT)fidelityloanfirm(DOT)webs(DOT)com and you will be as happy as i am.may the good lord bless them and reward them effortlessly for what they have done in my life. Indeed they are the best loan lenders.
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#133This is incremental progress, it's just one school. But a crazy step in the right direction. For-Profit institutions are a plague on our nation (high-cost low-value educations) allowed to rise up out of the failings of our strained public institutions (not enough capacity to meet demand). What really blows my mind is that this seems to come after the justice department discontinues for profit federal prisons. It's li…
> For-Profit institutions are a plague on our nation I dont understand. ANY for profit? Like Apple or Ford? Or just educational institutions? If just educational institutions, what is special about that sector that makes them a plague?
The reason for-profit educational institutions are a plague is that the US government provides for a special class of loans to allow people to go to college without having the cash up front.
This special class of loans has both a relatively low interest rate (making them appealing for consumers) and cannot be defaulted on, an important feature when there is no collateral for a loan. (This feature is not needed, for instance, when you buy a home, because if you default on your mortgage they can take your home, which you put up as collateral.)
This created the opportunity for investors to create educational institutions with a thin veneer of respectability, suck in any student who could qualify for loans, and funnel that money back to the investors. Which many did.
Removing the eligibility for this special class of loan for (all, or just the known offenders) for-profit universities removes this opportunity without actually outlawing for-profit universities. This opportunity only existed because of the federal government meddling in the free market, so everyone should be happy.
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#134Earlier quoted context omitted.
The decision is specifically targeting for-profit degree mills. The problem is that these institutions provide expensive educations, paid for by people taking out student loans (which the institutions actively encourage). However, these same institutions don't provide any sort of education that would give their students even a remote chance of paying off the student loans on any reasonable timeframe. This creates a s…
I'm just going to go out on a limb and say that most of the people going to ITT-esque schools are getting Pell Grants (free money, not loans) first and foremost to cover their costs. I didn't even know this was a thing until after I graduated (I never got a Pell Grant because my parents made too much money). Some schools have over 90% of their students funding their entire costs through Pell Grants (look at Universit…
It looks like ITT does/did have a large proportion of students with Pell Grants -- 23,500 out of 57,000 students. The tuition figures I can find for ITT are $18,000 / year, while the average Pell Grant to an ITT student was $1800 / year.
So 40% of ITT students got 10% of their tuition from ITT, and ITT got 4% of its revenue from Pell Grants.
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#135Earlier quoted context omitted.
>What's special about education per se? In the US? The fact that it gets paid for with loans that aren't dischargeable in bankruptcy.
I meant, what's special in terms of profits skewing incentives.
I would argue it's a combination of the high cost (we aren't talking about people ending up with a few thousand dollars of debt), the fact that it might take years to determine if any given school is actually not terrible, and the fact that "education" itself is given special considerations over many products and services.
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#136Earlier quoted context omitted.
I get what you're saying, but I think there is in principle something wrong. The theory of markets is that even if a company is staffed by the greediest sons of bitches, market mechanisms will force them to converge on delivering high customer value. But markets work best when you have savvy customers that purchase frequently, can quickly evaluate results, and can easily try other suppliers. Unfortunately, none of th…
And besides what you've already correctly noted, the theory of markets is just that, a theory. A very simplistic, idealized model that very quickly diverges from reality.
Oh, definitely. In theory, theory and practice are the same. But in practice...
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#137I'm torn on this. Understand, I have little love for ITT, and I got my 4 year degree from there. In hindsight, I wish I'd done community college and the local university instead. I honestly believe I'd have had a better curriculum, better books and a better ratio of instructors who cared to ones who didn't. I believe I'd have had to take on less student loan debt, as well. That said, suppose ITT Tech does lose its ac…
Degrees from these sorts of institutions are already arguably a black mark. I've seen this come up a few times in /r/sysadmin, and to some people, attending a school like ITT displays a shocking inability to do even the most cursory research before making a huge life decision. Fair or not, you can be almost certain you are not being considered for some positions because you attended ITT.
That's absolutely right, I'd actually prefer to hire someone without a degree and a strong desire to learn than someone with a degree from ITT
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#138I'm going to call BS on nearly everything said here about for profit schools. While I don't particularly care if ITT can't accept people relying on federal loans, I do believe that people aren't being duped by crappy schools so much as they are falling for them. Sure, the commercials have been everywhere for years, but it's really not hard for even the dumbest of dumb to type "ITT sucks" into Google and find all sorts of legitimate negative reviews. I have been to two trade schools for different careers; I chose them because there was almost nothing but positive reviews about them on the internet. I suspect that people attending scam schools have poor shenanigan-sensing skills and may subconsciously think that commercials on TV provide some sort of legitimacy. This is why I have no sympathy for the people who attended "Trump University", as at the very least you should go into such a program assuming there's a high chance it will sick and have an escape plan ready. But my generation doesn't seem to do that often and would rather rely on the safety nets provided by their parents and the state. Actually, it is a good thing that they can no longer take students with federal loans because those will be the same students whose ineptitude will fail them and then they will want the government to "forgive" their debt. LOL
Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#139Re: ITT is no longer allowed to enroll students who rely on federal loans and grants
#140Earlier quoted context omitted.
Plus anyone who thinks that "Public" schools are not for profit hasn't looked too closely. My "Public" University was basically a football program which had classes to try and justify its existence. Think Stanford isn't for profit? Harvard? University of California? The only difference is who is making the profit an what their incentives are. ITT doesn't make money if its students don't get jobs. Does UC Santa Cruz r…
I just love how all the leftists on HN have the down vote power and simply down vote and gray out anything they disagree with. Commies never change in any society. Since their arguments are weak it's easier to just make your opinion (or your very self in the USSR, Cuba, NK, etc.) disappear. Love it. Please make me dissapear too ;)
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