Coming changes to Apple's App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#131

Post by djrogers » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:41 PM UTC

archagon wrote: post #94

Bleh, subscriptions. I'm fine with them if your app is offering features that require use of your servers, but it seems many indie developers are interested instead in charging for the "privilege" of running local code on your device (as with Photoshop). I'll pass.

How about the 'privilege' of getting new features? Major app updates? Ongoing tech support and bug fixes?

One could argue that those should be included in the purchase price, but today's app store economy often doesn't allow that.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#132

Post by overcast » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:41 PM UTC

sotojuan wrote: post #115

overcast wrote: post #39

Am I the only one exhausted by "apps"? I've gone as far as to limit myself to only two pages worth on my phone, without folders. I feel like most apps could just be the mobile/responsive versions of the existing site. Maintaining separate interfaces always leads to inconsistencies.

If Apple supported the latest standards in mobile Safari, you could write web apps that work offline and have push notifications like on Android. That's not in Apple's interest though.

Serious question, why do we need apps that work offline? Finding it hard to imagine what you can do on a computer theses days without an internet connection, besides maybe an old single player game devoid of any patches.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#133

Post by rimantas » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:42 PM UTC

johansch wrote: post #77

I guess these are the kind of innovations we can look forward to while Cook is running Apple. :/

You can always switch to Android or Windows Phone if you like their innovations better.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#134

Post by post_break » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:42 PM UTC

MBCook wrote: post #119

post_break wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A simple trial period like Androids 2 hour window would avoid all of this subscription nonsense for your last point.

It's not nonsense, it's useful . Right now you get problems like Tweetbot. It costs money to maintain Tweetbot and keep it working, and to add new features. I use it every day, I'd be happy to 'subscribe' to it. As it is now they only get paid when I buy the app. If I keep using it for 4 years I may still expect support but they're not getting additional income. If you don't have enough growth to sustain you, what pe…

If I buy Tweetbot today, and it works today, it should keep working tomorrow. If I want new features I will pay for those features, update the app or make them an in app purchase, or create a new version number and charge for it.

This is like leasing vs buying, the only difference is with your example you'll get one choice, pay the lease, or pound dirt. I'd rather buy the app once and be done, and have the choice to upgrade at my discretion, than be forced to pay yearly.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#135

Post by tolmasky » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:43 PM UTC

bad_user wrote: post #92

chasing wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the mindset change that needs to happen is this: Apps are a service. I would actually prefer to pay developers of apps that are truly useful to me a monthly amount so I know they can continue to update and improve the app. If an app saves me $1000/yr in headache, I'd prefer to spend $30/yr on a subscription rather than lose the app entirely because the developers can't keep the lights on.

There aren't many apps that can save you 1000/year. I keep hearing this, but that's nonsense. If a "service" is not producing money and isn't saving you time allowing you to produce money, then it's not worth paying for. Yes, I have subscriptions for IntelliJ IDEA, for Dropbox, for FastMail and for a DigitalOcean VPS. All these are producing money for me. But the list ends here. Because here's the thing: $5/month her…

> ore importantly, subscriptions are immoral because the end result is robbing users of any sense of ownership. And as a software developer, you no longer feel compelled to innovate, to improve, in order to convince users to upgrade. I for one hate renting things, I prefer ownership.

Sure as long as you also accept that you are not owed bug fixes it updates. If you however believe that with system upgrades you should get corresponding app upgrades, then it starts to sound more like a service. I like subscription because I want developers to treat this as a service: support, fixes, features, etc.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#136

Post by rimantas » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:43 PM UTC

overcast wrote: post #128

rimantas wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What separate interfaces?

Native app vs web. There is always features missing from one or the other, and I'd much prefer one consistent interface at xyz.com no matter the device.

What web app? Do you think every app on app store has web version? I prefer apps, always I do not want consistent, I want good and smooth. Web apps sucked, suck, and will suck.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#137

Post by overcast » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:45 PM UTC

rimantas wrote: post #136

overcast wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native app vs web. There is always features missing from one or the other, and I'd much prefer one consistent interface at xyz.com no matter the device.

What web app? Do you think every app on app store has web version? I prefer apps, always I do not want consistent, I want good and smooth. Web apps sucked, suck, and will suck.

Read my initial post.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#138

Post by abalone » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:45 PM UTC

AlexandrB wrote: post #20

As someone who buys a lot of apps this is very disappointing. Things that would make me buy MORE apps (demos, upgrade pricing, better support) are still not in the app store, meanwhile the one pricing model I detest (subscriptions) is being added. I suspect I'll be buying far fewer apps if there's a mass movement from a purchase model to a subscription model among app developers. I'm perfectly happy to pay $20-30 for…

> I'm perfectly happy to pay $20-30 for an app

That's where you diverge from the population. Apple needs a solution for the general problem of people not wanting to pay much for iOS apps. It may disappoint those of us who prefer spending more up front for quality, but Apple has surely determined that more people will buy more apps this way.

(By the way, you compared paying $X upfront to paying $X per year which of course is a worse deal. A more representative comparison would be $X * 0.33 per year.)

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#139

Post by rodeoclown » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:47 PM UTC

In my opinion, the two most important features as a developer for the App Store:

1. Rolling deploys - right now releasing on iOS is scary and big bang, combined with the review process it keeps devs up at night worrying. 2. AB Testing on images and copy - you can only update this on each (scary) release, so you can't learn what works quickly.

Re: Coming changes to Apple's App Store

#140

Post by djrogers » Wed, Jun 08, 2016, 8:47 PM UTC

1_2__3 wrote: post #58

Apple wants a subscription service because then they can hobble the developers AND the users to prevent them from ever leaving.

App subscriptions would likely lead to more cross platform portability - if I'm paying $1/mo for your app, I won't care if it's on iOS this month and Windows Mobile next month, but if I paid $10 for your app, I don't want to repurchase it on a new platform.