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Computer, Respond to This Email

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Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#131
post #49
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The product is the service being offered, in the case of Google it's search, mail, maps, etc. How they make money is unrelated to what the "product" is. E.g. I switched from free ad-supported YouTube to the paid ad-less YouTube Red, does that mean what the "product" is suddenly changed? Also you really are the "customer" or "user" of the many services being offered by Google just like an advertiser is a "customer" of…

This is a lot of words that amount to "Nuh-uh!" The entire point of the "if you're not paying, you're the product" spiel is that everybody already knows everything you said, but there's a fundamental difference between paying and not paying. You're not going to get that far demanding that people stop thinking there's a difference, nor are people going to stop verbalizing that difference, nor should they. What's clich…

The reason this argument is so useless it that it is so non-specific. A useful form would be "This company is treating me poorly in way X because they have an incentive to do so." Instead, X is never specified, just implied via FUD.

Companies only interested in short-term profits might be willing to strip mine their users and treat them poorly. Companies that are interested in the long term have an incentive to treat their users well, i.e. as if they were paying customers.

Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#134
Privacy issues aside, please don't. These kinds of features are outright harmful to our society.

Human communication and our social skills in general have already detoriated a lot by replacing face to face conversations with audio only, then text.

This is just further taking away the incentive to sneak in something personal, something human into our written communication every now and then.

IMO, the very reason someone takes the time to type out these kinds of questions as an email message is to make it more personal. Otherwise, they could just use an rsvp/calendar system or a bug tracker for the particular queries in the article, which already enable you to send such generic replies with 1 or 2 taps at most.

Can we stop misusing technology to dumb down our everyday lives and stop transforming our society into a bunch of isolated individuals living on the same planet?

Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google does not sell "users", that's why it is inaccurate and misleading. What would you say of a private highway that sells billboards? If the business model of a private highway is not tolls, but instead selling ads along the road. "You're not the user, you're the product?" Would you say the highway owner is selling the personal information of the drivers? The people buying billboards do not receive any personal id…

> What would you say of a private highway that sells billboards? If the business model of a private highway is not tolls, but instead selling ads along the road. If it's funded primarily by the billboards and not by the drivers, then yes, the billboard purchasers are the real customers. And that could potentially lead to poor results, such as optimizing for billboard viewing time rather than safety and throughput.

Even if I accept your interpretation, it still doesn't justify the description "you're not the user, you're the product" In the case of the private highway example, even if the customers are the advertisers, the product being sold isn't the drivers, it's the billboard space.

Google's users are not its products. You might claim its users are not its customers (users != customers), but that does not imply the users ARE the products. Just like the New York Times readers are not the real business customers, the advertisers are, however no one has ever exclaimed "The New York Times Readers are the Products!"

The Product is the New York Times, because that is the thing _Being Produced_. It is the work product of the journalists.

Likewise, the work product of the engineers, SREs, PMs, managers, ops and support for Gmail is the Gmail Service. That is what is created out of the hours they put in. There is an ancillary product that leverages externalities produced those products (virtual real estate to auction off), but it is not people's data as the product being sold.

This meme is really tiresome because it doesn't get to the root of the matter, which is, are the incentives of those working on Google's products aligned with the incentives of the business operations which have to derive a return on those investments.

There are two ways to look at this depending on your level of cynicism:

1. Google is a smart company that looks at the long term and realizes value by the creation of positive externalities. That is, it works from the premise that if you make good products that please your users, you will retain and get more of them, and there will be opportunities to monetize that. That is, retaining users is paramount, ergo, user trust, branding, and generally not pissing off users is very important.

2. Google is a short sighted company that looks at what is currently has, lets bean counters manipulate its products purely to increase the bottom line by maximizing the amount of stuff they can sell. This means, they only consider the wishes of advertisers, and act to increase purely the amount of ads that can be shown, regardless of how much it annoys users.

Now, you can decide to believe #2 or #1 depending on how harshly you view the trajectory of Google products over the years. To be sure, they have done things that have annoyed users. But I believe, based on evidence of actually working here, that the primary impetus of engineers and product managers who guard the high level product features, that the focus is tipped towards user concerns.

Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#137

I'm often amazed how Google still gives it staff this unique hacker-like approach to their million dollar projects. For example, the stuff in Google labs (gmail) has had some silly things like don't hit send when you're drunk but sometimes very useful features which may be considered unorthodox like "Gmail telling you when it thinks you wanted to attach a file but forgot". It's something I wouldn't generally associat…

I think the attach file reminder is now part of regular gmail.

Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#138
post #90

Hey, remember that one time when this feature was Gmail's April Fools Day joke[1]? Kind of funny how it's now a serious and actually useful-looking product. [1] https://www.gmail.com/mail/help/autopilot/

Another Google April Fools Day joke, some years ago, was Google Paper, or some such name. IIRC it was funny.

Well, they kind of made that one for real too, didn't they? http://www.google.com/cloudprint/learn/index.html

Re: Computer, Respond to This Email

#140

I kept imagining it would generate responses based on MY past emails until the end of the article. Example "When does your flight leave for Paris?", I was imagining it would pull the info from Google Now to reply "Friday at 9am", but I don't think it is built for this type of specific question.

Knowing Google, they'll be working on that by the time they release this.
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