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Bootstrap 4 alpha

blog.getbootstrap.com

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Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#131

Post by davexunit »

thegeekpirate wrote: post #18
o_____________o wrote: post #9

They seem pretty confident about Sass; It seems outdated and clunky to me, in part because it's always going to be the only Ruby dependency in any of my projects. The Javascript parser never found parity from what I know. By contrast, PostCSS is faster and has massive adoption. Seems like the way forward. Anybody think this is wrong? > PostCSS can do the same work as preprocessors like Sass, Less, and Stylus. But Pos…

There's no reason to use Ruby https://github.com/sass/libsass

libsass is very strange. It must be statically linked and it requires copyright assignment for contributions.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#132

Post by lotyrin »

xrstf wrote: post #93
pyre wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in part because it's always going to be the only Ruby dependency in any of my projects. The Javascript parser never found parity from what I know. Now that libsass (C or C++ implementation) has matured, the Ruby dependency is not necessary. I always resented Sass (vs. Less) a bit because of the Ruby dependency (in projects not using Ruby otherwise). Now that you can link against libsass, I don't feel like that's an…

Yeah I really love how I now not only need Node and npm, but also gcc to install/build a frickin' web project. Because f*ck the platform-independence we got with Node, who cares if a simple `npm install` takes 30 minutes to complete.

I can't help but feel like the anti-native-extensions point of view is short sighted.

Why shouldn't we have optimized implementations of algorithms that we can share across various languages?

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#133

Post by lotyrin »

chillingeffect wrote: post #119
xrstf wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I really love how I now not only need Node and npm, but also gcc to install/build a frickin' web project. Because f*ck the platform-independence we got with Node, who cares if a simple `npm install` takes 30 minutes to complete.

I don't use it, so I don't know, but I'm just wondering, why is it necessary to use gcc to use libsass? Isn't there a PPA for it? Would a PPA be the proper way to distrib what sounds like a really valuable program? Thank you.

System level package management falls quite short of what you want for applications in a lot of ways still.

Different apps will want to specify and build against extremely specific and different versions of their dependencies, and developers will want to be able to change these versions without lots of organizational coordination between owners of dev/CI/stage/production environments.

Currently, this is solved by things like npm/bower/bundler/composer/maven/etc. etc. The code repository describes all the dependencies and they get installed just for that app, testing and deployment process simply incorporate the app's packaging tools.

However, for any dependencies which use native extensions, you tend to need to be able to compile those - across all your environments - which means having working toolchain everywhere.

Not that this is strange or hard in my opinion, but it seems to discourage people somehow.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#134

Post by julianozen »

Sorry dumb question. How can bootstrap safely use ES6? Isn't there limited compatibility? Are they using some kind of tool to allow it, or are they only using it for new browsers, and falling back to ES5 if they have to?

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#135

Post by sdnguyen90 »

mdo wrote: post #27
bluetidepro wrote: post #22

One amazing thing to note is that in v3.3.5 (last stable) bootstrap.min.css was at ~123kb. The new 4.0.0 alpha bootstrap.min.css is at ~88kb. WOW. That's just amazing. Congrats to everyone who worked on this project. I'm always so impressed with the work done on it! Also, I want to add, I don't care where you land on the side of the debate whether to use Bootstrap or not, there is some very smart minds behind the pro…

Thanks for noticing! :) I spent a lot of time deleting stuff lol. Still more to optimize around though as we work through the alphas.

Saw on your Twitter that V5 will use PostCSS... Is this still planned? If so, any specific details on how it will be used?

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#136

Post by McGlockenshire »

julianozen wrote: post #134

Sorry dumb question. How can bootstrap safely use ES6? Isn't there limited compatibility? Are they using some kind of tool to allow it, or are they only using it for new browsers, and falling back to ES5 if they have to?

They're probably using a preprocessor like Babel[1] or something like es6-shim[2]

1: https://babeljs.io/ 2: https://github.com/paulmillr/es6-shim/

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#138

Post by ttcbj »

mdo wrote: post #27
bluetidepro wrote: post #22

One amazing thing to note is that in v3.3.5 (last stable) bootstrap.min.css was at ~123kb. The new 4.0.0 alpha bootstrap.min.css is at ~88kb. WOW. That's just amazing. Congrats to everyone who worked on this project. I'm always so impressed with the work done on it! Also, I want to add, I don't care where you land on the side of the debate whether to use Bootstrap or not, there is some very smart minds behind the pro…

Thanks for noticing! :) I spent a lot of time deleting stuff lol. Still more to optimize around though as we work through the alphas.

+1 for sincere thanks. bootstrap is one of many factors that had made a lean development approach so much easier.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#139

Post by notNow »

zecho wrote: post #117
joshburgess wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Booooooooooo. Bootstrap is the most popular CSS/UI framework on the planet. I don't get why they continue to depend on jQuery while most modern app frameworks are abandoning it...

Like which? Ember continues to depend on it. Angular uses a lightweight version. I don't think there's a lot of interest in reinventing the wheel as far as cross-browser JS libraries go.

I guess Backbone uses jQuery too.

Re: Bootstrap 4 alpha

#140

Post by notNow »

coderdude wrote: post #59
hliyan wrote: post #6

Also launching official bootstrap themes: http://themes.getbootstrap.com/collections/all Edit: unfortunately though, the 'dashboard' theme is not fully responsive (tables (order history) in mobile view)

I hope this leads to a 'standard' way of developing Bootstrap-based templates. Something comparable to the submission guidelines on WrapBootstrap but codifying how a template's assets should be arranged, written, etc. Using Bootstrap as a base for new template designs was a major step forward for the template industry because customers aren't walking into a completely foreign codebase with each purchase. If that fami…

Why that standardization should be done a la Bootstrap and not any other framework?
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