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Elon Musk AMA

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Re: Elon Musk AMA

#121

The moderators of r/IAMA apparently deleted several of the highest voted questions. http://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/2rgzgo/official...

I was trying to follow what happened. It appears that prior to the start of the AMA, various subreddits, such as r/teslamotors, collected questions within their subreddit that they wished Musk to answer, then posted them in the AMA and upvoted them.

Moderators of /r/AMA see that as "vote brigading" and hid or deleted the questions so that Musk could not answer them.

Did I get that right in terms of what happened?

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#122

The moderators of r/IAMA apparently deleted several of the highest voted questions. http://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/2rgzgo/official...

I was trying to follow what happened. It appears that prior to the start of the AMA, various subreddits, such as r/teslamotors, collected questions within their subreddit that they wished Musk to answer, then posted them in the AMA and upvoted them. Moderators of /r/AMA see that as "vote brigading" and hid or deleted the questions so that Musk could not answer them. Did I get that right in terms of what happened?

Well the AMA was supposed to be SpaceX only. I'm not surprised that questions about Tesla were deleted or ignored.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikipedia at this point is one of the primary sources for everything on the internet. At the early days of wikipedia, you could pick any topic and there would be major articles unwritten. It was far best to have some article than a great article. I can't comment exactly on the editor situation of the wiki, but it's to be expected a shift to more specialized and aggressive "curation" of articles, specially of more sol…

> Wikipedia at this point is one of the primary sources for everything on the internet. That is explicitly what it isn't, anything but that. > I can't comment exactly on the editor situation of the wiki, but it's to be expected a shift to more specialized and aggressive "curation" of articles, specially of more solidified topics. Wikipedia's fantastic performance contradicts this argument. Wikipedia would still be a…

Google uses it for their semantic searches and Apple/Microsoft use it for their personal assistants. So this idea that Wikipedia isn't a primary source of information is nonsense. It is.

Until it stops being the first search result for the majority of "typical" searches it will remain a primary source of information.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#124

I really like this comment https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2rgsan/i_am_elon_musk... Saying that he has no idea what is going to happen with the launch tomorrow, its a refreshing honesty. I was also wondering on an semi unrelated note if HN had ever had AMA's from interesting people? I am not preposing that they should start happening though.

It's cute but I don't really buy it. You think he hasn't asked his engineers what the chance of success is? And that they haven't calculated it using actual numbers based on the previous test landings?

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#125
post #108
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the unfamiliar, this is essentially the line of thinking behind Roko's basilisk .[0] While a mature superintelligence certainly could consign the human race to a fate of eternal suffering, the likelihood it would actually do this while sparing certain individuals in return for their assistance is infinitesimal. Therefore, helping bring a superintelligence into existence on this basis is absurd. Of course, it is p…

The point again is that regardless whether or not the likelihood a mature superintelligence doing so is infinitesimally small (and frankly, we can't know that, but see also below) is irrelevant. What actually affects us is how many people may come to believe that this may be true, and adjust the way they act as a response. But you're already changing the argument when assuming a mature super-intelligence. All that is…

>What actually affects us is how many people may come to believe that this may be true, and adjust the way they act as a response.

Agreed, though it seems more likely that simple human carelessness will prove to be a far greater threat to AI safety than deeply-held beliefs involving esoteric fears.

>But you're already changing the argument when assuming a mature super-intelligence.

I was speaking strictly in a capability sense. It's probably safe to say that anything currently simulating our reality, at least in this context, ultimately stemmed from a mature superintelligence.

>Note that Roko's Basilisk even posits a Friendly AI. That is, one that is imbued with respect for human values, but that may simply consider "threatening the past" with torture a necessity in order to ensure it is created as a moral imperative to minimize human suffering.

One could argue that such an AI would not truly be friendly. Indeed, what you said resembles something of a cold, uncaring utility function run amok.

>Note that such a Friendly AI would have reason to carry out this threat even if it believes it exists and so has been created, because it will not know whether it is a "full version" running in reality, or a partial, restricted, time limited simulation by people trying to figure out whether or not Roko's Basilisk holds before deciding whether to let it loose in their reality.

This may be moot, assuming that the advent of superintelligence significantly predates, or at least is a prerequisite for, the simulation of entire realities. If people in an ancestor simulation are trying to see if the Basilisk holds via simulation of a child reality, then the ancestor reality almost certainly has a superintelligent agent present within to facilitate that.

As an aside, ontological issues that superintelligent agents may encounter are an interesting facet of the control problem. Especially when you consider that a superintelligence would likely figure out the secrets of the universe in short order, far beyond what humans have been capable of learning.

>Then again, there may very well be one or more fundamental flaws in the entire argument, ...

Lack of evidence. Without any, there's no reason to lend any more credence to Roko's basilisk than there is to the notion of space aliens living amongst us, perfectly manipulating our perceptions so as to conceal themselves.

Both scenarios are entirely possible. But we lack evidence for either. Hence, they should receive the same weight: zero.

>But it's fun to think about.

In a sort of soul-crushing kind of way, it sure is.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#126
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what the word is, but I don't think its "corollary." Its the anti-corollary.

Niels Bohr: "Two sorts of truth: profound truths recognized by the fact that the opposite is also a profound truth, in contrast to trivialities where opposites are obviously absurd."

Ok, added that one to my quotations file.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#127

I really like this comment https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/2rgsan/i_am_elon_musk... Saying that he has no idea what is going to happen with the launch tomorrow, its a refreshing honesty. I was also wondering on an semi unrelated note if HN had ever had AMA's from interesting people? I am not preposing that they should start happening though.

It's cute but I don't really buy it. You think he hasn't asked his engineers what the chance of success is? And that they haven't calculated it using actual numbers based on the previous test landings?

Yes, but as a scientist / engineer, he really doesn't know.

He understands the data and the computation results, but those have yet to be correlated to the authority, nature.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#128
post #22
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's actually a country song.

Musk attributes it to Churchill though I don't think anybody has found any evidence that the prime minister ever said it. The earliest evidence anybody can find of the phrase came from the 90s.

Practically every famous quote ever has been attributed to Churchill, so I'm skeptical.

But it really is a country song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l50L4GYhpLc

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#129

I found his comment regarding learning to be the most insightful. It is a more developed explanation of what I have found to be an effective strategy for me: > One bit of advice: it is important to view knowledge as sort of a semantic tree -- make sure you understand the fundamental principles, ie the trunk and big branches, before you get into the leaves/details or there is nothing for them to hang on to. Without th…

It seems like common sense, but it's so difficult to do sometimes. I agree completely.

When I first started learning Linux for example, I didn't just learn the commands I needed to do certain things, I tackled everything. I spent months and months learning everything I could about it. I bought a giant Linux book and went from cover to cover. I learned about things I would never use (and probably still haven't).

I pushed myself to recompile the kernel even though I didn't need to. Then I did it probably 50 more times that month. No joke. Crashed my system. Rebuilt it. Rinse, repeat.

After laying down that foundation in the 90s, I've kept up on it but Linux is so very "easy" for me. Setting things up and getting work done is extremely intuitive, far more so than it is in Windows or OSX. So when people ask me why I prefer it I tell them it's a personal preference because it's so easy for me, and I even I forget that foundation I laid.

I have taken on other pursuits the same way, such as development but I notice any technology that I half ass learn just to get stuff done.. is hard. Sometimes I wish I had enough time in my adult life to build such a strong foundation in something like.. JavaScript for example. And I bet if I added up the time I spent struggling in the beginning I would have been able to do just that.

But yeah, long story short this is absolutely the best way to learn something. Build that trunk.

Re: Elon Musk AMA

#130

I found his comment regarding learning to be the most insightful. It is a more developed explanation of what I have found to be an effective strategy for me: > One bit of advice: it is important to view knowledge as sort of a semantic tree -- make sure you understand the fundamental principles, ie the trunk and big branches, before you get into the leaves/details or there is nothing for them to hang on to. Without th…

Yes, early in my career I used that analogy of a tree, large branches, small branches, and leaves.
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