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Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

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Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#121

Post by wizzzzzy »

iandanforth wrote: post #7

I've visited Cuba on a Canadian passport. Aside from the beautiful beaches the thing that struck me most was the desperate poverty of people living in shacks outside the 5 star resorts. While I hesitate to predict that this change will be all for the good, I do believe that the poorest in Cuba will benefit significantly from increased trade.

I visited Cuba a month or so ago and one thing that struck me was the way a general lack of wealth didn't manifest it's self in a way in you'd associate with impoverished people in developed countries. The quality of the health and education systems are tangible and one of the biggest points of contention from the people I spoke to seemed to be the lack of internet.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#122

Post by encoderer »

joezydeco wrote: post #17

The timing seems really clever here. The USA and OPEC flood the market with oil (literally), crashing prices and sending the Ruble into a spiral. Just as Cuba starts to worry about Russian support going forward, the USA swoops in to provide some economic bracing.

I think you're giving these people way too much credit. As if the shale oil boom was a plot all along. And it doesn't seem like they've had much support from Russia for most of the last 25 years so why would they worry about losing it now?

I think it's tempting to connect the dots. But they're just dots.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#123

Post by tarekmoz »

johnward wrote: post #44
valarauca1 wrote: post #5

This is actually (amusingly) incredibly unpopular in cigar circles who are calling this the "end of an era". Most discussions seems to center around the doom and gloom of quality dropping and prices increasing as the US/Cuban cigar market opens and the demand for CC increases. No discussion on the legality of owning CC changing amusingly. As apparently everyone forgets that smoking a Cuban Cigar can be considered an…

My understanding, as a non cigar smoker, is that the quality of Cubans has decreased and they are only popular because of illegality of them.

Nope. I smoke cigars weekly and I can tell you Cuban cigars are the bests (they are allowed in my country).

In the U.S. you will find the same brands like Partagas, but they're made with blends from other countries than Cuba, and they are really inferior. I tried a bunch of them and Cubans wins everytime.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#124

Post by mudil »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #119
mudil wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The greatness of Cuban health care system is an urban myth, just like Jackalope.

http://www.wired.com/2010/04/cuban-health-lessons/ "Despite a 50-year trade embargo by the United States and a post-Soviet collapse in international support, the impoverished nation has developed a world-class health care system. Average life expectancy is 77.5 years, compared to 78.1 years in the United States, and infant and child mortality rates match or beat our own. There’s one doctor for every 170 people, more…

"There are shortages of medicines, and the best care is reserved for elites."

Nice healthcare system!

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#125

Post by toyg »

eigenvector wrote: post #98
wcummings wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans could previously go there, they just couldn't spend money there and no airlines offered flights from the US.

I think you will find US dollars (cash) accepted quite readily in Cuba.

Of course, but the problem is that US authorities have a problem with you giving US dollars to Cuban businesses. You can go there and spend, sure, but when you go back, somebody will (should) knock at your door. Obviously this doesn't happen to simple tourists, only to Jay-Z/Beyonce and businessmen.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#126

Post by scintill76 »

eigenvector wrote: post #98
wcummings wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Americans could previously go there, they just couldn't spend money there and no airlines offered flights from the US.

I think you will find US dollars (cash) accepted quite readily in Cuba.

I think the point is that it was illegal (under US law) in many cases for Americans to spend money there (probably in any currency).

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#127

Post by Florin_Andrei »

mudil wrote: post #116
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> my point is that significant trade doesn't necessarily trickle down to the poorest Nothing trickles down to the poorest, spontaneously, almost anywhere in the world.

That's absolutely not true. People live better across the world today than they lived 50 or even 20 years ago. I read statistics somewhere that people in some obscure African country today (can't recall the name) have a living standards of Finland of 20 years ago. Think about this: the major health issue nowadays across the world is obesity, not hunger.

You're talking about the longest-term possible scale, which is called progress.

We were talking about everything below that scale.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#128

Post by calibraxis »

polarix wrote: post #68
debacle wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cuba flaunts the US hegemony from right under their noses, but they have great wealth in their geographic location, and their society. Cuba could become the Switzerland of the western hemisphere given the right outset.

What does "given the right outset" mean?

The US is the militant world hegemon. Which happily sends uniformed killers halfway around the world to take control. Proximity to the US isn't healthy for freedom-lovers with browner skin.

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#129

Post by toomuchtodo »

mudil wrote: post #124
toomuchtodo wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.wired.com/2010/04/cuban-health-lessons/ "Despite a 50-year trade embargo by the United States and a post-Soviet collapse in international support, the impoverished nation has developed a world-class health care system. Average life expectancy is 77.5 years, compared to 78.1 years in the United States, and infant and child mortality rates match or beat our own. There’s one doctor for every 170 people, more…

"There are shortages of medicines, and the best care is reserved for elites." Nice healthcare system!

Please explain how that's any different than the US when you can't afford medicine or care? It makes little difference whether the shortage is due to no physical supply vs not being able to afford it. If you can't get healthcare, you can't get it.

http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/health/2014/03/26/medical-ban...

“In 2013 over 20% of American adults are struggling to pay their medical bills, and three in five bankruptcies will be due to medical bills. While we are quick to blame debt on poor savings and bad spending habits, our study emphasizes the burden of health costs causing widespread indebtedness. Medical bills can completely overwhelm a family when illness strikes,” says Christina LaMontagne, VP of Health at NerdWallet. “Furthermore, 25 million people hesitate to take their medications in order to control their medical costs. Unfortunately this can lead to even worse financial outcomes as preventative treatments are not rendered and patients end up using expensive ambulance and ER care as their health worsens.”

Re: Cuba and the U.S. will begin to normalize relations

#130

Post by cheez »

soperj wrote: post #58
infecto wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately I do not think this is the full truth. I believe there should not be an embargo BUT the embargo is not the main cause of poverty in Cuba. Cuba has a huge tourism industry. A lot of the business that serve tourists are state owned. Where does this money go? Everything from hotels to restaurants are state owned. Who is profiting here? I think at this point its less personal and more choice. Cuba chooses t…

Technically wouldn't it be everyone profiting since it's going to government? If it was an foriegn business owner like alot of resorts in the bahamas, who would be profiting there? Certainly not the people living on the island.

Even in a democracy you'd be lucky if that were even 10% true. In a socialist government, even more unlikely.
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