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How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

patrick-wied.at

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Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#121

Post by WorldWideWayne »

stevekemp wrote: post #109
metacorrector wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just can't sympathize, at all. I would prefer (I realize this is not the law) an internet that was considered public domain. If you don't want you picture copied, don't put it in the public domain. I do understand hard work, and skill, and putting in the time that made you the great photographer that you are, and I understand the need to earn a living, and I understand capitalism, economic profits, and accounting p…

> If you don't want you picture copied, don't put it in the public domain. Most of my pictures are prints, hanging on walls. But you need a portfolio to attract (paying) clients, so images have to exist! > I understand your perspective: you'd rather buy a proprietary microsoft operating system and a proprietary microsoft webserver so you could run a proprietary Oracle database to keep track of your DRMed photos. So i…

> and the same thing is a huge deal in the photography world.

Is it big enough to start deploying the lawyers? That's what software companies have to do. If you're not doing that, then it must not be a big enough deal to you. If you CAN'T do that, then I think you should get out of the biz.

But, I bet you won't because you are probably getting something more than money out of your career. Maybe you enjoy the work. If it were all about money, you would have become a banker, right?

No sympathy here either. You have no natural right to get paid every single time one of "your" images is used. (Oh and who owned the stuff you took a picture of? Should you pay them to photograph it? Should they get paid every time the image is used?) With no natural rights, you have to use the legal system. Nobody cares if you sue some big corporation, but please...complaining about people posting stuff to imgur.com? What money was lost because your image showed up there? Did you try sending them a cease and desist? I bet they'd take it right down. If you don't do that, then you're not trying hard enough.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#122

Post by scrollaway »

WorldWideWayne wrote: post #117
scrollaway wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is unbelievable that the entire comment thread is filled with people saying it's a bad article, it can be worked around, etc, when: 1. The article is an experiment on techniques and what can be achieved. 2. At the VERY BEGINNING of the article, the author links to his own comment in a previous HN post which said "I do not advocate using any of the techniques, please don't use it, it's terrible and will give your u…

The person you're responding to didn't say "it's a bad article" or that "it can be worked around". I'm guessing that the root comment was simply a reaction to the title. I bet they didn't even read the article. However, you must be aware that the majority of the technical user community hates DRM. Regarding your points 1, 2 and 3... where does it stop? Should we always be enthusiastic about experimentation for the sa…

Congratulations on hitting as many fallacies as you possibly could in a single comment. You managed to compare, literally, "poisoning the water supply" with... web development.

You know where it stops? It stops when you start putting people in danger. I cannot believe you're seriously asking that question (and yet, I have to believe you are seriously asking that question, because the alternative is that you're an awful troll).

I would like to encourage you to read my comment, and then read it again, and keep doing that until you understand the difference between killing people and blogging on the internet. I would then like to encourage you to read up on things such as "white hat hacking", pentesting and so on to give you an insight as to why, in the IT world, if the good guys don't push the limits first, the bad guys will.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#123

Post by shmerl »

stcredzero wrote: post #114
shmerl wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you simply use the term DRM incorrectly. You think DRM means information security. It doesn't. "Turning it around" makes it not DRM anymore.

"Digital Rights Management" -- you know, words mean something . If it's digital, and it's used to manage rights to that digital information, then it applies. Also, if you had a clue to the academic and research origins of DRM, you'd know it's also "trusted execution." DRM as you are aware of it in the hands of Sony et al is just one single application of DRM/trusted execution. Just like HTML is just one application o…

> "Digital Rights Management" -- you know, words mean something.

They mean what they were designed for. And that is excessive preemptive policing. About "trusted execution" you are wrong. Original meaning of trusted execution is exactly about security, not about DRM. Actual usage of that term is more than often happens to be about DRM (which is conflicting with security actually, because DRM can be viewed as a security risk).

See https://youtube.com/watch?v=XgFbqSYdNK4

If you constantly mix up security, authentication, trusted execution with DRM, I think you should consider your own level of knowing what you are talking about. I explained everything above.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#124

Post by WorldWideWayne »

scrollaway wrote: post #122
WorldWideWayne wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The person you're responding to didn't say "it's a bad article" or that "it can be worked around". I'm guessing that the root comment was simply a reaction to the title. I bet they didn't even read the article. However, you must be aware that the majority of the technical user community hates DRM. Regarding your points 1, 2 and 3... where does it stop? Should we always be enthusiastic about experimentation for the sa…

Congratulations on hitting as many fallacies as you possibly could in a single comment. You managed to compare, literally, "poisoning the water supply" with... web development. You know where it stops? It stops when you start putting people in danger. I cannot believe you're seriously asking that question (and yet, I have to believe you are seriously asking that question, because the alternative is that you're an awf…

Fallacy schmallacy. I was talking about blogging about experiments in poisoning people (just a bit, not killing them :) Anyway, you don't think people are harmed by DRM? Of course they are. Time and water are among the most valuable things we have and DRM steals away everybody's time so a few can profit.

Let's try another hypothetical title: How To Force Your Neighbors Take Out Your Trash or, How To Write A Virus That Steals Banking Information...How To Really Embarrass Your Coworkers...9 Ways To Enrage Internet Commenters...(this is fun!)

Would you applaud those experiments? I'm guessing YES since "It stops when you start putting people in danger." and nobody is being put in danger.

(BTW, I'm just doing my own experiment here - I guess I should have said that. You're not being a very good sport though ;) Seriously - I'm sitting here trying to understand your point of view and I made some POLITE arguments. You mis-represented one of my arguments and then patronized me to the extreme, so is that the kind of behavior that you're promoting?

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#125

Post by stevekemp »

WorldWideWayne wrote: post #121
stevekemp wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you don't want you picture copied, don't put it in the public domain. Most of my pictures are prints, hanging on walls. But you need a portfolio to attract (paying) clients, so images have to exist! > I understand your perspective: you'd rather buy a proprietary microsoft operating system and a proprietary microsoft webserver so you could run a proprietary Oracle database to keep track of your DRMed photos. So i…

> and the same thing is a huge deal in the photography world. Is it big enough to start deploying the lawyers? That's what software companies have to do. If you're not doing that, then it must not be a big enough deal to you. If you CAN'T do that, then I think you should get out of the biz. But, I bet you won't because you are probably getting something more than money out of your career. Maybe you enjoy the work. If…

OK so you don't believe that people should be rewarded for their creativity, that people should have their licenses honoured in any field of endeavour.

I have sent cease and desists in the past, in the same way that I've sent DCMA takedown notices against people who post documentation I've written with no attribution, and against people who've forked my code and pretended to have authored it.

But I'm done with you now.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#126

Post by stcredzero »

shmerl wrote: post #120
moheeb wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The previous poster is talking about personal DRM. You keep misunderstanding what they are saying. In the personal DRM case it would not be invading " your private digital space ", you would be using it to protect your digital space. It is not like " a police camera placed inside your house. " It is the equivalent of the homeowner placing a security camera themselves to protect their property.

There is no such thing as "personal DRM". That's what you and the previous poster fail to understand. DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space. Protecting your own digital space is called security. Let's be clear on terms usage, otherwise time will be wasted because of misunderstanding.

No. You fail to understand that DRM as practiced by Sony et al is just one application. In one way, it's understandable if you had not been exposed to the academic literature early enough, because after a certain point, political activism, popular accounts, and corporate literature swamp anything more academic and general.

DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space.

Or about voluntarily giving some autonomy up. In the case of organizations like Facebook, they would be giving up autonomy, such that they would only run certain audited versions of certain software. Given that such companies have large numbers of computers aggregated in a relatively small number of locations, the economics of verifying these mechanisms is much more favorable than the inadvisable "traditional" use of DRM has been.

You are not going to be able to process ideas like this properly, if your only background is uneducated Internet backlash.

Protecting your own digital space is called security. Let's be clear on terms usage, otherwise time will be wasted because of misunderstanding.

Throughout, you have been insistent on an imprecise, popularized usage of terms. I will agree, however, that time has been wasted because of misunderstanding.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#127

Post by WorldWideWayne »

stevekemp wrote: post #125
WorldWideWayne wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and the same thing is a huge deal in the photography world. Is it big enough to start deploying the lawyers? That's what software companies have to do. If you're not doing that, then it must not be a big enough deal to you. If you CAN'T do that, then I think you should get out of the biz. But, I bet you won't because you are probably getting something more than money out of your career. Maybe you enjoy the work. If…

OK so you don't believe that people should be rewarded for their creativity, that people should have their licenses honoured in any field of endeavour. I have sent cease and desists in the past, in the same way that I've sent DCMA takedown notices against people who post documentation I've written with no attribution, and against people who've forked my code and pretended to have authored it. But I'm done with you no…

Specifically on the topic of photography though - Do you feel that the owner of the object of your photograph should get paid every time the image is shown though? Where does that end? For instance, if you shot a famous building - do you think the architect should get paid? What about the construction workers? The current owner?

That was really my main gist. Sorry for not being sympathetic. I thought I made a pretty good argument. I was not trying to be impolite, but I can see how it could be taken as such. Could you just answer that one question? I'm really interested in the fine line that is being discussed here.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#128

Post by [deleted] »

stcredzero wrote: post #126
shmerl wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no such thing as "personal DRM". That's what you and the previous poster fail to understand. DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space. Protecting your own digital space is called security. Let's be clear on terms usage, otherwise time will be wasted because of misunderstanding.

No. You fail to understand that DRM as practiced by Sony et al is just one application. In one way, it's understandable if you had not been exposed to the academic literature early enough, because after a certain point, political activism, popular accounts, and corporate literature swamp anything more academic and general. DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space. Or about voluntarily givin…

[deleted]

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#129

Post by shmerl »

stcredzero wrote: post #126
shmerl wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no such thing as "personal DRM". That's what you and the previous poster fail to understand. DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space. Protecting your own digital space is called security. Let's be clear on terms usage, otherwise time will be wasted because of misunderstanding.

No. You fail to understand that DRM as practiced by Sony et al is just one application. In one way, it's understandable if you had not been exposed to the academic literature early enough, because after a certain point, political activism, popular accounts, and corporate literature swamp anything more academic and general. DRM is always about policing others by invading their digital space. Or about voluntarily givin…

> You fail to understand that DRM as practiced by Sony et al is just one application.

They created the term and they polluted it for good. Trying to whitewash it now serves no useful purpose except causing confusion. If you want to talk about concepts of protecting your personal information - just use another term, otherwise misunderstanding is guaranteed (like above).

> popularized usage of terms

No, it was you who tried to create your own interpretation of DRM which differs from what its designers put into it. That's up to you, but don't expect anyone to understand you.

Re: How to prevent screenshots in a web browser

#130

Post by meshko »

There is a silly Russian saying which school teachers usually use on that really smart asshole kid in the class -- "a fool got blessed by smart head". Somehow reading this made me think of that. Also think of the environment, how much power will you waste on this useless hack if it were to get wide adoption (not going to happen of course, but _if_)
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