Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#121

Post by mildtrepidation » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:06 PM UTC

seldo wrote: post #46

My parents, who live in Trinidad, have this problem every time they visit me in America. After a couple of days of everyone fake-smiling at them the whole time they get pissed off. To them, everyone's smiles come off as insincere and even slightly condescending. (They hate it even more when people tell them to "have a nice day".)

That it's a cultural phenomenon in the US and not in [other place x] does not make it immediately fake, and that some people may be faking it (I'll assume this is the case for argument) does not mean the phenomenon itself is fake.

I'm an American that smiles and greets strangers regularly. It's not fake when I do it, and I know it's not fake when many of my acquaintances do it.

I do know that this is not a natural/universal thing (though it took a trip to Japan for me to materially understand that). But just because it's not universal doesn't mean that, where it happens, it's backed by some kind of underhanded, guarded cynicism.

So have a nice day. ;)

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#122

Post by kutakbash » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:10 PM UTC

forgottenpaswrd wrote: post #6

I would say it is the terrible weather, too cold in winter, too hot in summer. It probably means something like "serious people are the rulers, because if you do stupid crazy things you are dead" over thousands of years that forge a culture. Russia is so big, and yet so ugly. I took the transsiberian train and it was so boring. In 40kms of Chile you see more than in 3000 of transsiberian. In Winter there is no light,…

>"serious people are the rulers, because if you do stupid crazy things you are dead" over thousands of years that forge a culture.

This is the pinnacle of all the BS political mythology in this thread. Stalin and his best friend Rasputin would so totally impale you for smiling.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#123

Post by RivieraKid » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:12 PM UTC

bowlofpetunias wrote: post #35

It's interesting how an article like this provokes multiple reactions that come down to "the American way is the right way". Also, unlike the article suggests, I think Russians are closer to (fellow!) Europeans than Americans in this respect. The way the Russians described in this article perceive Americans is not that different from the way most Europeans do.

That has a simple explanation, people naturally try to maintain positive self-image about them (ie upvote comments that make them feel about themselves). And most hn visitors are american (who are also above-average patriotic).

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#124

Post by pandaman » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:17 PM UTC

pyre wrote: post #52

javert wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Socialism makes every other person a potential enemy and a potential victim. Resources are scarce. People come to hate one another. Capitalism makes every other person at worst a neutral non-threat and at best a potential trading partner. Resources are plentiful. People feel benevolent towards one another. This is not an apology for America; America is only semi-capitalist. You can see Americans getting meaner over t…

> Socialism makes every other person a potential enemy and a potential victim. Resources are scarce. People come to hate one another. You're taking a look at countries that have implemented 'socialism' and ended up with what amounts to dictatorships. Do you really think that Communism as envisioned by Karl Marx included someone like Stalin, or the corrupt officials that inhabited governments in the Eastern Bloc? For…

Do you think that the life, as envisioned by children, who want to eat only ice cream when they grow up, includes scurvy, diabetes and other effects of such a diet?

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#125

Post by kombine » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:19 PM UTC

Being a Russian and having lived in a Western country long enough I started noticing that I use this fake smile all the time when I bump by someone. Not sure whether that's a good or a bad thing, but at least it is a code of conduct here.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#126

Post by sergeykish » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:22 PM UTC

blah32497 wrote: post #13

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

Can't agree more. People are broken here, I've heard so many times from my mother "don't attract attention, be as everyone". Life was tough, truth could harm. Lying brainwashing system, under control of fools it's better to hide emotions under brick-face. Parts of that system is still around - school, university, city services, army. They are awful.

People are pour, angry, have no sense of life, my friends advice "don't sing and dance outside, it's dangerous". I don't know why they live.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#127

Post by eps » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:25 PM UTC

cLeEOGPw wrote: post #98

BetterLateThan wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't sound like a Russian. You don't think like a Russian. You don't know like a Russian. Russians don't smile because any person who smiles to a stranger either wants to sell something or is insane. Smiles are for friends, real friends - whopping 2 or 3 of them. "And if anything goes wrong you can be... No sense of community..." This part betrayed you. You don't know anything about Russia or Russians. If an Afr…

Your example with african college and skinheads do not show a sense of community, it just shows widespread racism among russians. Because if a group skinheads attacked black or gay the whole subway would still help skinheads to beat that single person, or at best not interfere.

I'll tell you this - back in Soviet times there were little to no racism towards black people. In part due to Soviet Union helping to "liberate" a good chunk of African countries back in 60s (and through people viewing them as our friends) and in part due to black people simply being an oddity. Also the past slavery and segregation matters in the US, the enemy no. 1, helped them winning some inherent sympathy.

But then Perestroyka came and African exchange students somehow managed to become a reliable source of hard drugs. At least in Moscow. And gradually the attitude changed.

That said no one would help a skinhead beaten up in a subway. Whatever the GP is smoking, it's potent.

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#128

Post by ChrisNorstrom » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:28 PM UTC

legohead wrote: post #69

blah32497 wrote: post #13

As a Russian-American this comes off as complete BS. I've seen this written before and it's always in the form of "It's not us that smile too little, it's you Americans that are fake and smile too much!". For one, Americans don't just smile to be polite. For the most part it's genuinely conveying positive emotions. Now I know this is going to be unpopular, but I think the real reason Russians don't smile is cultural.…

As an American who married a Russian and lived in Russia for a while, I find this article to be quite accurate. When visiting for the first time, I asked my (then-acquaintance) why women never smile at me. She said "if they smile at you, that means they are easy." Basically, they are saying they like me and I should introduce myself. Or, like the article mentioned, maybe I look funny. You are right in that it is cult…

Russians are racist? Care to explain further. That's like saying Italians are racist. What caused you to reach that conclusion?

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#129

Post by Demiurge » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:32 PM UTC

jedmeyers wrote: post #85

pyre wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Socialism makes every other person a potential enemy and a potential victim. Resources are scarce. People come to hate one another. You're taking a look at countries that have implemented 'socialism' and ended up with what amounts to dictatorships. Do you really think that Communism as envisioned by Karl Marx included someone like Stalin, or the corrupt officials that inhabited governments in the Eastern Bloc? For…

Karl Marx should have envisioned that someone like Stalin might exist in the future and will take over the power, otherwise his perfect Communism system is only applicable to perfect people.

Perhaps it is also not applicable to geopolitical co-existance with imperialist countries like Nazi Germany and the USA?

Re: Why Russians Are Not Smiling (2011)

#130

Post by kylequest » Mon, Nov 18, 2013, 11:33 PM UTC

Smiling there is more personal... and smiles are more valuable. And just like with anything valuable or good if there's too much of it it looses its value (a bit like money and inflation or recent startup valuations :-))