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I'm tired

andymoore.ca

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Re: I'm tired

#121

Post by reeses »

rescripting wrote: post #102
niggler wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"deemphasize social experiences in favour of other things" The situation shows an active effort in eschewing societal norms. You have to work hard to shut down the mental filter that normally prevents you from making such an off-kilter remark

The set of rules you internalize to be "normal behaviour" is influenced by your environment. A boy growing up in an isolated household in the woods will have a different model of normalcy, and so when he goes in to town he'll seem "off" to everyone else. My favourite pop culture example of this is Mose Shrute (Dwight's brother) from The Office (US). He doesn't try to be weird, he just is, because he's grown up in fam…

In what relative normality is it acceptable to tell a group that one of their members received something due to her "award-winning tits?"

I'm all for multi-lateral motives, but some things are wrong for anyone "in town," whether they rode in on a buckboard or lived there their entire lives.

Re: I'm tired

#122

Post by reeses »

mlent wrote: post #120
kunai wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell the person to fuck off. Okay, I may get many downvotes here, but this doesn't seem like the solution to the problem. Rudeness and insults are rudeness and insults. Cursing doesn't help the matter. Inaction is not the solution either, but I'm sure there's a more mature way to handle things. Asking the party to leave politely is better than keeping your mouth shut, and it also seems better than cursing them out. O…

It probably depends on the person. With a guy who uses phrases like "because tits", "fuck off" might be the only thing that makes it through his thick skull.

Right. There are a number of attempts to generalize the terms of the discussion, but "because tits" guy is a specific wanker. It's OK to say things to this person precisely because of his specific behavior.

Re: I'm tired

#123

Post by rescripting »

reeses wrote: post #121
rescripting wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The set of rules you internalize to be "normal behaviour" is influenced by your environment. A boy growing up in an isolated household in the woods will have a different model of normalcy, and so when he goes in to town he'll seem "off" to everyone else. My favourite pop culture example of this is Mose Shrute (Dwight's brother) from The Office (US). He doesn't try to be weird, he just is, because he's grown up in fam…

In what relative normality is it acceptable to tell a group that one of their members received something due to her "award-winning tits?" I'm all for multi-lateral motives, but some things are wrong for anyone "in town," whether they rode in on a buckboard or lived there their entire lives.

Spend an evening playing Call of Duty on XBox, then extrapolate that experience to a lifetime.

Re: I'm tired

#124

Post by lowboy »

verbalist wrote: post #119

Wait, nobody's even bringing up the fact that maybe the game developer didn't get the pass on merit alone? Yeah, the comment was rude (people are rude everywhere, always), but maybe he had a point.

That is utterly irrelevant to this conversation.

Re: I'm tired

#125

Post by asher »

How does a wise and tactful man react to a tactless remark in a large group?

He doesn't. He might try to direct the conversation to more agreeable matters. He certainly doesn't draw attention to the offense and impress it indelibly in the minds of the others.

Generally, you are better off improving your own behavior than that of others. As Dale Carnegie pointed out, it's not only more profitable; it's less dangerous.

Re: I'm tired

#126

Post by famousactress »

rayiner wrote: post #41
famousactress wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So.. You're probably right. Here's my (quite possibly unreasonable) defense of the language I suggested... It grinds conversations to a halt. "I disagree, but.." doesn't register shock. That's not the kind of language people use when they witness horror, or abuse. It's not emotional. If anything, if I was at the table and that was your reaction I'd probably take it to mean that your primary takeaway is to be annoyed…

I agree with you 100% fuck off conveys exactly the response a comment like that warrants. It singles out the speaker and separates him from the conversation, just like his comment did to the woman. If he wants back in, he has to do so awkwardly and sheepishly, which is I'm sure exactly how the woman in the story felt

I'm conflicted about my feelings about this, but that's exactly my intent when I speak like this to someone. It's the desire to make them feel small and communicate how little I have respect for them in that moment. I'm honestly not sure if that's healthy. If I was charged with defending the opposing view I'd argue that it's fighting bullying with bullying, or that maybe the ability and desire to make insensitive comments like that in the first place come from feeling small and I'm only fueling the fire. I'm really not sure. I just know that it's worked for me in the past, at least in the small... in situations where I've wanted to diffuse a situation and shut someone up who's expression was abusive. I'm not convinced there's not a better way, though. I just really hope the takeaway to this thread isn't that I think it's obviously perfectly righteous and productive to react like this, just that I think it's (at least occasionally in my experience) effective, and vastly preferable to doing nothing.

Re: I'm tired

#128

Post by famousactress »

richforrester wrote: post #92
famousactress wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So.. You're probably right. Here's my (quite possibly unreasonable) defense of the language I suggested... It grinds conversations to a halt. "I disagree, but.." doesn't register shock. That's not the kind of language people use when they witness horror, or abuse. It's not emotional. If anything, if I was at the table and that was your reaction I'd probably take it to mean that your primary takeaway is to be annoyed…

"Fuck you registers shock, and anger." Correct, but I assumed "I'm tired of losing friends over this" could refer to either side in the argument. If you don't want to hurt anyone, brush off silly comments and move on. If you want to make a point, by all means. ps.: "fuck off" might also trigger more discussion, which he's trying to avoid. It's easier to say "my opinion is different" than "your opinion is stupid".

I feel the need to emphasize. This was not a silly comment. It was abuse. This wasn't misplaced careless language, overheard. This was a targeted and abusive insult to another person who was sitting across the table.

Brushing off the 'silly' comment and moving on is the easiest way to hurt the target more than the comment already has.

I agree that it's easier to say that "my opinion is different", but it's chicken-shit and offers a level of respect that signals unwarranted sympathy. "Your opinion is stupid" would be a profoundly more appropriate statement had it been be, because it much better describes my feelings.

Without making specific slippery-slope arguments, surely at some point we'd all find it ridiculous to say "Thanks, but my opinion is different" after witnessing something disgusting, right? So I guess the question is where that line is for us individually. "You got this pass because of your tits" is severely past that line for me. It's miles deep into "Fuck off" territory.

Re: I'm tired

#130

Post by wonderzombie »

norswap wrote: post #36

Not this again. The kind of people who make this kind of comment don't give a shit about this kind of blogpost.

That's because they're not the target audience. It's a call to action for everyone who may have witnessed a scenario like that one and didn't tell the guy to fuck off.
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