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The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

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Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#121

Post by jpatokal »

yogar wrote: post #96
ajtaylor wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was concerned about this very thing when I was preparing to immigrate to Australia. In the end, because I had a job offer I got in on a 457 (good for 4 years) and didn't have to pay the ACS' accreditation fee. Even better, in 6 months when I apply for Permanent Residence I still don't have to pay the ACS because I've been working here for 2 years.

I am not sure this holds.

It does: I transitioned from 457 to permanent residence (ENS 856) without paying ACS a cent.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#122

Post by jacques_chester »

Nursie wrote: post #106
throwaway2048 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rent control may have been a factor in many major American cities, but it is far from the only contributor. Australian cities currently have many of the same structural problems that lead to these issues in American cities in the sixties seventies and eighties. Suburbanization tied with ridgid regulations that make property development or improvement extremely costly lead to a downward spiral in property values, whic…

Downward spiral in property prices? I take it you haven't been to Perth lately?

Or Darwin.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#123

Post by jacques_chester »

jpatokal wrote: post #111
lancewiggs wrote: post #68

Firstly - come to New Zealand. There is long list of ICT/Electronics and Communications roles, including all professional engineers, on the long Term Skills Shortage list. Additionally ICT and creative indistries are deemed long term growth areas. This means it's much easier to get into NZ - either for working or for immigration through our points system.[1] On the ground the answer is yes, we really need more devs a…

The main problems with working in IT in NZ are that there aren't many jobs, and the pay is much lower than in Australia. And since Kiwis and Aussies have reciprocal working rights, there are a whole lot of Kiwi IT people who've moved to Australia.

I've been told that NZ is seen as a backdoor into Australia.

I don't know if that's a genuine phenomenon or whether it's just a third-hand mutation of some shock jock talking point.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#124

Post by jbarham »

aohtsab wrote: post #77
lessnonymous wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We know they exist. They're just irrelevant. It says a lot if you prefer to tell us you're an ACS member rather than that you write code for fun at home.

This is interesting to hear. I'm in the process of applying for an Australian visa (no CS degree). To get an independent visa, I need 2 more years of work experience, before I qualify to apply to have my skills tested by ACS in very specific (and almost esoteric) programming knowledge. And this is only the first step to apply for an 'invitation to apply' for a visa. What are my job prospects as a US software develope…

> What are my job prospects as a US software developer seeking to emigrate to Australia?

Frankly, assuming you have the right to live in the US, you are much better off staying in the US if you want to maximize your opportunities as a software developer vs. moving to Australia.

I say this as a Canadian who worked as a software developer in Southern California for 4.5 years but moved to Australia two years ago, largely to escape the restrictions of US work visas and try my hand at doing my own startups.

Sydney and Melbourne are the only two cities in Australia with sizable markets for software developers. Compare that to multiple regions in the US with large software industries (SV, SoCal, Texas, Research Triangle, NYC).

There are very few pure technology companies in Australia so the vast majority of software development is in-house development for banks, insurance companies etc. Australian companies also tend to be relatively conservative in terms of technology platforms so PHP, .NET and Java are the norm vs. Python or Ruby.

Certainly there are very talented and capable software developers in Australia, but the software industry is so small and under-valued (compared to e.g. mining or real-estate development) that there's very little opportunity to advance professionally.

Check out http://www.seek.com.au/ to get a feel for what jobs are on offer.

http://www.realestate.com.au/ is also interesting to get a feel for the eye-popping prices that Australians pay for housing. (I rent.)

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#125

Post by guard-of-terra »

verelo wrote: post #40

I'd love to hear Matt's views on TAFE, i think accreditation has a very important place in our society (mainly because i got very sick of uneducated morons charging people for fixing computers, writing bad code...etc) Anyway, the fact that Matt is complaining about fees and then is happy to be associated with the Singularity University that chargs $25k for a course ( http://apply2013.singularityu.org/res/p/faq/ ) mak…

Accreditation is a tool of retaining economical privileges of certain class, not an instrument for weeding off morons.

Morons still get in. There's no accreditation in the whole world that says "This guy or girl is not a moron."

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#126

Post by sc0rb »

beilabs wrote: post #58

Here's my experience with the Australian Computer Society. Having studied abroad (Ireland), I was required to send in all of my exam results for my B.Sc, H.Dip & M.Sc. as well as a reference from each employer that I worked with in my field (Software Engineering). For the visa I was applying for at the time it required that I was certified by the ACS, have a minimum of 5 years experience. The process took 6 months fo…

Quick questions. Is it possible to migrate to Australia (Sydney) if you only have a DipHE (didn't finish last year of uni) and have around 2 - 3 years full time Software Engineering experience or MUST you have a BSc?

Also, I am potentially doing this through my current employer rather than as a skilled independent migrant.

Thanks

Edit: I'm from London

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#127

Post by sc0rb »

lessnonymous wrote: post #67
djt wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the main problem is you need the accreditation if you want to apply to immigrate. As I understand it even if you are from overseas and study at a Australian university you would still need to get the accreditation to apply for a visa.

If you want to enter under the skilled migrant program, I expect you're correct. However as an employer, I've hired a bunch of people from overseas on a 457 visa and never thought to get them to talk to the ACS. I don't really care if your university degree has been rubber stamped or not. (And if you can write code, I don't really care too much about your degree)

Is it possible to get people from outside of Australia to migrate for work on a 457 visa without having to get their skills assessed by the ACS?

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#128

Post by beilabs »

sc0rb wrote: post #126
beilabs wrote: post #58

Here's my experience with the Australian Computer Society. Having studied abroad (Ireland), I was required to send in all of my exam results for my B.Sc, H.Dip & M.Sc. as well as a reference from each employer that I worked with in my field (Software Engineering). For the visa I was applying for at the time it required that I was certified by the ACS, have a minimum of 5 years experience. The process took 6 months fo…

Quick questions. Is it possible to migrate to Australia (Sydney) if you only have a DipHE (didn't finish last year of uni) and have around 2 - 3 years full time Software Engineering experience or MUST you have a BSc? Also, I am potentially doing this through my current employer rather than as a skilled independent migrant. Thanks Edit: I'm from London

Your employer should be able to get you on a 457 visa fairly easily; they just need to prove that you are qualified to do the job and they can't find a local to undertake it. The 457 binds you to that employer for the term of that visa unless you find another employer to take it over.

You would have issues getting a different visa than the 457 though, they require 5 years experience if you do PR by yourself.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#129

Post by yitchelle »

jacques_chester wrote: post #12

I basically joined the ACS because it's there and I figured I ought to. They gave me a post-nominal: CT. If I want the next grade up -- CP -- I will need to take thousands of dollars of synergising-outside-the-box courses. Basically the ACS isn't really for software engineers. It's for middle management. I won't be renewing. (I might renew my ACM/IEEE memberships).

When I graduated from University, there was a big push to join IEAust. I thought it was a good idea, but they were really trying to push the engineering profession rather than the actual engineering itself. So I opted out after the first year.

It wasn't cheap either. I remember the fee to be around $700 per year. That was in 2002. And for a graduate, I would rather spend that $700 for something with a better ROI, like rent or food on the table.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#130

Post by damian2000 »

rmc wrote: post #113
Nursie wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went through the same process. Yes it took longer than I would have liked, but in general it went very well. Australia is very restrictive on immigration because so many people want to go there. I'm not really sure why they would restructure the system when this is the case, they have a relatively small population and extend a variety of state benefits to immigrants, so they don't want to be swamped.

They used to have a "White Australia" policy until late 60s. (Basically yes, we want immigration in order to populate our country, but we only want white people). Since then they have stopped having racist immigration policies, so they have just reduced all immigration. It's all about keeping one type of immigrants out.

Last year, India and China were the biggest sources of immigration to Australia - 29,018 and 25,509 ppl respectively. Followed by the UK at 25,274.

http://www.workpermit.com/news/2012-07-20/australia/indians-...

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