Live data from Hacker News

Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

falkvinge.net

121–130 of 172 posts

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vigilante justice is what happens when actual justice is not available. If you don't like vigilante justice, ensure actual justice.

Maybe it's worth hearing Aaron's own words to understand the folly of attacking this one person: When you’re upset with someone, all you want to do is change the way they’re acting. But you can’t control what’s inside a person’s head. Yelling at them isn’t going to make them come around, it’s just going to make them more defiant, like the GM workers who keyed the cars they made. No, you can’t force other people to ch…

You won't find me in disagreement with a campaign to change or repeal the CFAA and similar laws. But I think you mistake the point of attempts to remove these prosecutors. It isn't about them as individuals, it's about them as symbols of the broken system they represent. I would not be surprised to learn that the average prosecutor would have done exactly what these ones did, but that's the issue. You can't be a saint while working in a factory whose product is human imprisonment. We need to shut down the factory and turn it back into a justice system, and in the meantime disgorging a high profile offender can serve as a warning to the others -- that seems like something prosecutors should be able to relate to.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#122

Ortiz was nominated to her position by Obama in 2009. She resides in Milton, MA where it just so happens Gov Patrick, Obama's close personal friend also resides. She's well-connected and a double diversity quota. She's going nowhere.

Which is a eye opening to show the hipocrisy of the white house.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vigilante justice is what happens when actual justice is not available. If you don't like vigilante justice, ensure actual justice.

Maybe it's worth hearing Aaron's own words to understand the folly of attacking this one person: When you’re upset with someone, all you want to do is change the way they’re acting. But you can’t control what’s inside a person’s head. Yelling at them isn’t going to make them come around, it’s just going to make them more defiant, like the GM workers who keyed the cars they made. No, you can’t force other people to ch…

The goal is to make the next politically-motivated prosecutor think twice before unleashing hell on some kid.

Right now the only feedback these asshats ever see is positive. That leads to an unstable system.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#124
post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only if it's followed up with a petition to "return all taxpayer money wasted on egoic pranks". There was always a way forward to achieving Aaron's goals that didn't involve sneaking around. Whether he was right or wrong, he knew on some level that what he was doing was, at the very least, inappropriate and potentially harmful. If not, then why attempt to hide his face? If not, why even do it at all? It's a sad and u…

> Only if it's followed up with a petition to "return all taxpayer money wasted on egoic pranks". If someone keys your car, and you spend $5,000,000 tracking them down to punish them, it doesn't mean they've wasted $5,000,000 of your money. It means you're a moron.

Yes. But in Aaron case there were NO victims and NO ONE tried to recover anything lost from Aaron's actions, besides prosecution of course.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#125
post #47

I'm not sure what this petition is trying to accomplish. Do you think, should the President fire Ms Ortiz, she would be replaced by someone completely different? Her actions are a reflection of the entire justice system; the person who replaces her will continue with the same bullying, "String 'em up in Town Square"-style tactics as she did. Everything will continue as it has been, but now the affluent, Bay-area 20-s…

That is a curious argument. The point of this petition, and everything else done to remove Ortiz, Heymann, and Garland is that it is a repeatable process. Making a spectacular example of Ortiz et. al. is a first step, but it's a fine first step. Or put it this way, would we have as many lawyers willing to shield torture had John Yoo ended up delivering pizza for a living?

I'm not seeing much to remove Heymann or Garland. There's another petition for Heymann, but that's not getting near as much traction as the Ortiz one, even when I've seen numerous commenters claim he was the one behind the case.

What's going on with these petitions is exactly the tactic politicians use to calm the populace down when they're screaming for something to be done after a scandal or catastrophe. Removing Ortiz would give everyone the vengeance they desire but it wouldn't do a damn thing because the people qualified to replace her are all just like her.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people pretty well understand the facts here. We have understood them for a long time. Current law makes everyone a criminal. Prosecutors threaten young people with excessive sentences to coerce them into plea bargains. None of this is new information. What we have lacked before is the will to do what is necessary to fix it. And if you have an idea how to do that, let's hear it. Because "heads will roll" is n…

Better suggestion: Find out first if the 30 year sentence was actually chosen to be handed down, or had to be put in place due to the way the law is currently written. If it is the latter demand the law be fixed, not the person who's job it is to enforce the law.

The trouble is that it's both. The law should never have allowed a sentence that ridiculous for the act Swartz allegedly committed, but prosecutors also choose what to charge. So we do need to fix the laws to prevent excessively aggressive prosecutors from having anything that outrageous to charge minor offenders with. I would even admit that that is the more important achievement.

But we still need to do something about excessively aggressive prosecutors too, because they can still do plenty of damage with knives and guns even after we take away their nuclear weapons.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#127

This petition could be a ticket and an opportunity for the administration to begin such a change... Yeah, because we all know how well Obama's "change" went. How's gitmo going? What about those executive orders? Seen any drones in the Middle East or northern Africa lately? Surely there is no more cronyism in the White House or Justice Department. I realize not every promise can be kept, but I've never regretted a vot…

There's a difference between international and domestic security policy.

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#128
It is a shame that the petition to pardon Swartz has 1/10th of the signatures that the petition to fire Ortiz has. Let's advocate for a government that forgives (alleged) crimes as strongly as we advocate for a government that punishes people like Ortiz.

http://twitpic.com/bvjjvz https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/posthumously-pardo...

Re: Petition To Fire Aaron Swartz’ Prosecutor Reaches Goal

#130

It is a shame that the petition to pardon Swartz has 1/10th of the signatures that the petition to fire Ortiz has. Let's advocate for a government that forgives (alleged) crimes as strongly as we advocate for a government that punishes people like Ortiz. http://twitpic.com/bvjjvz https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/posthumously-pardo...

Swartz is dead, so I don't know what pardoning him now would accomplish other than securing a useless symbolic 'victory'.
Post reply on HN