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SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

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Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#121

Post by Barbing »

RobotToaster wrote: post #103
mrandish wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The problem here was that they didn't announce to the host that they are doing a test of their in-development equipment. I might be okay forgiving skirting the disclosure rules BUT only if they tried to be model tenants and, if there was any damage, took steps to proactively make things right. If you're breaking the rules, even if there was no damage, you should definitely be cleaning up and putting things back in…

This was my thought. I can understand not wanting to go to the hassle of trying to explain that you're testing an experimental prototype robot to a confused Airbnb owner. What I find inexcusable is not owning up to the damage and paying to fix it when your prototype goes on a rampage of destruction. Moving fast and breaking things is fine, as long as you fix the stuff you break...

> We are backed by Greenoaks, NFDG, Spark, Eclipse, Kleiner Perkins, Y Combinator, and many others who

are too broke to pay for scratched furniture?

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#122

Post by bluGill »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #25
ssl-3 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, it's good that they're testing things in different places. Environments vary. But hundreds of millions sounds like enough money to get some industrial or dead commercial space (even in/around SF) and outfit it to be like an apartment. Or six different ones, and six others two weeks from now, and two weeks after that. The cost of the space and the carpenters/painters/drywallers/handymen/managers/whatevers woul…

They want realistic randomness in the apartment layouts. This is a quick, effective way to get that. If they were honest with the hosts, it wouldn’t even be a bad idea.

You don't need that until the very end. They should be modeling many houses first, and they can get that by having employees measure their own house. They should also know something about the edge cases and have a lot of very unrealistic houses modeled.

Then they should have a lab with real furniture and movable walls so they can do controlled real world tests. Once the above tests are done you add confidence with random real world tests.

The types of problems seen here are things that your lab tests should fail and keep you out of real world tests. Particularly when the test subjects don't have some sort of test agreement

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#123

Post by close04 »

21asdffdsa12 wrote: post #115
close04 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The were incompetent enough to go to real world testing when these issues would have been obvious from a basic model kitchen test. Obviously their bot is in the very early development stages where it can't do any of the basic things right, they're nowhere near the phase where they needed real world testing. You don't need a real house to tell that your bot keeps damaging furniture, floors, and other items. You iron t…

Also obviously the money is running out when you rush to testing

I think you're right and hope this stunt damages their valuation. As an investor I would have serious doubts about a company which at this stage doesn't have the brain or the money to have a proper development plan and resorts to desperately throwing anything out there, hijacking an Airbnb rental as their lab. That reeks of incompetence, maliciousness, and desperation rolled into one.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#124

Post by redsocksfan45 »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #37
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #26

The only way to stop this is for charges to be brought against the employees who made the bookings under false pretenses.

Why the employees? Do you think they were operating without direction from their managers? If we want to put a stop to this sort of behavior from businesses we can't be punishing employees for this behavior, we have to run it up the chain.

[dead]

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#125

Post by bluGill »

TZubiri wrote: post #14

Can any lawyer clear this up for me? If the company ends up having no commercial success and the lawsuits for damages rack up, can they just close the company file for bankruptcy and face no consequences? Or is there some civil or criminal risk to this behaviour?

Lawsuit results get priority in bankruptcy court and so are still likely to pay out. The exact order varies by country, type of bankruptcy, and I'm not a lawyer. in general when you are bankrupt there is money just not enough and the courts decide who gets it. That money often exists after selling everything (desks, computers, chairs...) even if there is none now. The courts then decide who gets it, court fees, bankruptcy lawyer fees (if reasonable), banks, then the owners. Often the banks will take the company as a whole and put in new management if the business is otherwise good (think plumbers where the business is likely good but they can fail for bad management, tech companies like this they may give up on)

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#126

Post by tclancy »

elzbardico wrote: post #72
tclancy wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. Growing up Gen X, I always thought robots being used for evil would be cool dystopian dictatorships that would try to grind me under its boot but I would resist. Instead it’s just twerps who are so terminally online they can’t fathom other people seem to have feelings. Now I’m getting even angrier imagining the email that went around internally on how to spin this and why it was a short term loss but will be fo…

the banality of evil is a recurring theme in human history.

Yes, but I was kinda hoping Hannah Arendt’s lessons had been internalized and we would progress. More the fool I.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#127

Post by Barbing »

fjni wrote: post #13

> Founded by alums of Tesla and the autonomous vehicle company Cruise, the San Francisco startup has received hundreds of millions in venture capital funding and is valued at $2 billion Stop outsourcing the cost of your vision to the rest of society. Especially when it’s peanuts to you and meaningful to, in this case, the host of what they call an apartment and you seem to think is a test course.

Well said. Unfortunate anyone would necessitate the Airbnbanhammer, and the lawsuits, but could be important tools here.

Scamming homeowners out of relative peanuts is super cringe. Everyone looks bad:

- Employees - Management - Investors - Previous companies listed

& “move fast & be antisocial” Bot Co. too. Photograph/video walkthrough the rental beforehand, safeguard antiques/uniques, professionally restore to 100%, nobody ever has to know. Or call host, drop cash.

Make people whole - this is so much easier than your robots, guys.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#128

Post by venzaspa »

kortilla wrote: post #57
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's exactly this ethos, the "move fast and break things", and oh, we don't give a fuck about who/what we damage in the process - careless people indeed. I am someone who came of age during an incredibly hopeful time about how technology could be a force for good. The silicon valley ethos at present is totally morally bankrupt and rotten to the core.

Cups and plates in the wrong places, the horror!! This generation is cooked. /s I wonder why that was on the same level of complaints about broken things.

But why don't they take the same money and get a cheap industrial unit and build some mock rooms up. Surely it costs the same as hiring and subsequently fixing peoples houses.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#129

Post by rsynnott »

fjni wrote: post #13

> Founded by alums of Tesla and the autonomous vehicle company Cruise, the San Francisco startup has received hundreds of millions in venture capital funding and is valued at $2 billion Stop outsourcing the cost of your vision to the rest of society. Especially when it’s peanuts to you and meaningful to, in this case, the host of what they call an apartment and you seem to think is a test course.

> Founded by alums of Tesla

That tracks.

Re: SF startup is testing robots in Airbnbs, and trashing them, lawsuit claims

#130

Post by rsynnott »

iknowstuff wrote: post #41

The fact that this made it to the news cycle is indicative enough of the airbnb owner smelling money once they found out a robotics company is involved, regardless of the extent of damage/wear

Eh? This sort of corporate misbehaviour would obviously make the news; it’s both scummy and just bizarre. That makes for good news.
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