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An AI Hate Wave Is Here

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Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#121

Post by customguy »

wilg wrote: post #114
customguy wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> doing better than ever on most important metrics I'd say the most important metrics are those that matter to people, not those that other people say should matter to them. Births are going down, suicide is going up, but they're just drama queens, we ran the numbers... that is what turns mere criticism into hatred. Less and less people own a bigger and bigger share of wealth, and they're too often not decent people…

Look, don’t know what to tell you, there is lots of extremely reliable well vetted and well understood information about the welfare of people on this planet and in what directions it is moving. Pretending information is imaginary or offensively abstract because you’re upset about income inequality (which is even more of an abstraction) is not good or helpful.

Then why are we not happier than ever?

And are you saying you would not in fact not mind being treated worse than other people today, as long as you're getting treated better than someone in the stone age? You completely sidestepped that part of my comment, only to frame me as somehow upset and irrational, such as

> "Pretending information is imaginary or offensively abstract because you’re upset about income inequality (which is even more of an abstraction)"

Fairness and justice matter. Sure they're abstract, so is happiness, so is hate. Come to think of it, none of the important stuff, none of the in-between stuff that makes any of the measurable stuff real and meaningful, can be easily measured. And how people feel about their lives and where society is going matters because they feel it, not because it filters down to some numbers you happen to accept.

And even IF everything was getting better all the time, it would still matter that people don't feel it. They're not "tempted" by being unhappy, nobody wants to be. Pretending that's the case for the majority of people, just because you're upset human reality is messy and wet is not good or helpful.

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#122

Post by mercer »

al_borland wrote: post #50
antiquark wrote: post #22

To put it simply, nobody wants to watch AI slop. This should be obvious!

That might be obvious, but when a significant number of people don't pay enough attention to know something is AI, or simply watch it anyway and then scroll onto the next clip, so it keeps them engaged rather than bouncing them off the platform, it's still doing it's job of retaining attention to push more ads. Most people I know will claim to not like AI, but they happily continue to scroll their Facebook, Instagram…

I'd say I'm pretty attuned to detecting AI content and I was fooled a few times at inattentive moments. I imagine a lot of people fare worse, assuming they even truly mind whether it's AI or not.

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#123

Post by mercer »

thrance wrote: post #84

AI is capital incarnate. People can finally put a name on an unease that's been growing inside them for a while now. We see these subhuman billionaire ghouls invited on TV daily to fearmonger about AI finally replacing all labourers and freeing the Epstein class from relying on these pesky workers. We see them making millions in fake money with each announcements, while the rest of us have nothing to show for it. We…

> People can finally put a name on an unease that's been growing inside them for a while now.

I've had some interesting conversations about the pre-AI slop and how the distinction is often not too meaningful. I mean, on some level /knowing/ that the corporate slop was written by a person kind of loses its meaning when one considers the amount of filtering, rules, rewriting, and so on is involved by a string of people who either don't care about what they write or actively dislike it.

A lot of this stuff often had at least flickers of a human soul behind it. I imagine for a lot of the soaps, hallmark movies, and romance novels this might've made some difference, even if just subconsciously recognizing the author(s) and building up some kind of image around the other by yourself or with others.

I'm reminded of some of the truly awful 'worship' songs I grew up with, and how some of the authors (often of course sticking close to the source material) even had a kind of following. some of these songs were just a little 'too' predictable, but others felt pretty much like they were written by AI, except back then none of us imagined that AI could really do this back then.

Or the pastor I spoke to who was convinced that chatgpt had access to his more personal notes, because as an experiment he made it write a sermon, and it (probably? obviously?) extrapolated from the prompt the more specific theology he followed/ascribed to.

I'm not knocking the value of a sermon or song, even if boring and predictable, or perhaps even when AI-written. they often explicitly /don't/ serve the purpose of being novel or new, but I find it super interesting how these aspects of real life are, to a degree, not too hard to replace with AI.

Thankfully for this pastor, most of his value involved human connection, knowing whoever just married, died, got sick, and having his full humanity on display from the pulpit!

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#124

Post by HumblyTossed »

ElProlactin wrote: post #34
epistasis wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that the creepiness of the tech CEOs that show up in media has a ton to do with this too, as they seem like cartoonish villians. Alex Karp, in particular, has some of the most absolutely horrifying clips of his TV appearances circulating all over video social media. But Musk has broader reach, and is even more oblivious and has tied himself to someone who he himself accused of pedophilia. Andreesen, Thiel, Sa…

It might not be your intention, but your comment seems to imply that the problem here is more image than substance. The problem isn't that these people are simply inarticulate and incapable of expressing their views in ways that appeal to people. It's that their views are unappealing (if not downright objectionable) to most people.

They're all cryptofascists who have become so powerful they can start to reveal themselves more clearly.

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#125

Post by wsve »

karim79 wrote: post #68

I don't really see the problem here. We're all getting laid off because AI I superior to us. I can now do the job of a product owner or even exceed it by simply prompting with some nuance, magic spells and bit of salt and pepper. But down the road the AI bros promise us that this will reduce inequality and make human society better, somehow. I really need to understand this shit and if anyone can weigh in on it I'd b…

It's simple. AI companies don't have a long term plan besides "sell AI" and "reduce labor costs with AI". Any promises made outside of that are simply them saying whatever they think will help to sell AI.

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#126

Post by salemh »

wilg wrote: post #16
Avicebron wrote: post #6

It's not AI. Like the layoffs AI is a convenient scapegoat for the economy creaking to a halt, real world income across most sectors won't buy a house in the state where the job is. It's hate, but it's only "against AI" because AI is being trotted out why people can't get their first home until they are 50 if they are lucky..

Fortunately the complaints about the economy and homeownership are also just folk wisdom that doesn't really reflect reality https://www.cnbc.com/2024/09/05/how-gen-z-outpaces-past-gene... The economy, real wages, etc are basically higher than ever (despite idiot Trump's best efforts). People are mad because being mad is fun and we're all on being mad machines 24/7.

[dead]

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#127

Post by wilg »

customguy wrote: post #121
wilg wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look, don’t know what to tell you, there is lots of extremely reliable well vetted and well understood information about the welfare of people on this planet and in what directions it is moving. Pretending information is imaginary or offensively abstract because you’re upset about income inequality (which is even more of an abstraction) is not good or helpful.

Then why are we not happier than ever? And are you saying you would not in fact not mind being treated worse than other people today, as long as you're getting treated better than someone in the stone age? You completely sidestepped that part of my comment, only to frame me as somehow upset and irrational, such as > "Pretending information is imaginary or offensively abstract because you’re upset about income inequal…

You're not going to believe this, but happiness is well studied too: https://ourworldindata.org/happiness-and-life-satisfaction

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#128

Post by thunky »

pllbnk wrote: post #118

So, what happened here is they stole all public works ever created and took them for themselves. All copyright laws were ignored without any repercussions, all the litigations of the past (Aaron Swartz for example) have been ignored. And they use it to enrich themselves by re-selling those public works after applying a lossy compression algorithm to prevent them being exact replicas. If the public hypothetically agre…

Have you caught these models violating copyright in responses?

Or are you saying that learning is a violation of copyright?

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#129

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

pllbnk wrote: post #118

So, what happened here is they stole all public works ever created and took them for themselves. All copyright laws were ignored without any repercussions, all the litigations of the past (Aaron Swartz for example) have been ignored. And they use it to enrich themselves by re-selling those public works after applying a lossy compression algorithm to prevent them being exact replicas. If the public hypothetically agre…

The idea of "all the public works ever created" is easily contested. Not every work has been "published", let alone scanned, digitised or published to the internet

The marketing for "AI" uses phrases like "the sum of all human knowledge" to refer to what has been used to create "models". The assumed irrelevance of non-published, "private" works is dubious if not absurd

The internet now allows potentially anyone to publish anything, e.g., via personal websites, social media pages, etc. But that doesnt mean everyone partakes. How much of the unfiltered garbage published by those who do has been used to create these "models"

"AI" companies will not reveal exactly what "works" were used to create the "models"

Re: An AI Hate Wave Is Here

#130

Post by pllbnk »

thunky wrote: post #128
pllbnk wrote: post #118

So, what happened here is they stole all public works ever created and took them for themselves. All copyright laws were ignored without any repercussions, all the litigations of the past (Aaron Swartz for example) have been ignored. And they use it to enrich themselves by re-selling those public works after applying a lossy compression algorithm to prevent them being exact replicas. If the public hypothetically agre…

Have you caught these models violating copyright in responses? Or are you saying that learning is a violation of copyright?

Learning isn't. Models are not learning, it's just a metaphor for the lack of better words to describe the process of ingesting data and adjusting weights accordingly.

My point is, they took all this data for free without paying the authors and crammed it into the models. And once it's inside the model the proof of copyright violation disappears.

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