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Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

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121–130 of 204 posts

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#121

In other words, "EU governments please give me money." Not saying that American companies are better in this regard, but if we interpret each CEO's words with the same scrutiny as how we view Elon or Altman's words... that's pretty much it.

I think he's asking to cut red tapes than money. EU was the first to regulate AI even without any company in EU producing a frontier model.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#122
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No but to come to Europa, you get less differences in wealth (essentially) universal healthcare at low/reasonable cost (ie, I can get cancer and not feel it financially), and a lot of state support when you're out of a job. Etc. Thos things cost tax money.

>you get less differences in wealth Yes so if you were in the higher percentiles of wealth, like many engineers in the US, you'd end up with less wealth in Europe, while if you were in the lower percentiles then in Europe you'd end up with more wealth. That's how redistribution works, the top 10% of income earners end up with less (even after accounting for healthcare and education; they get back less then they put i…

Could these software engineers be bankrupt if they are hit by a serious illness? Say progressive MS or a cancer, which will require extensive sick days? It is there protection?

(this is an actual question, not an ironic one)

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the problem is not the model, but the infrastructure needed to run the model. so yeah, gpus, cpus, network, etc etc

Power is 2-3x as expensive in Europe than American. They're toast.

It's not. France: €0.149/kWh (~$0.175) US: ~$0.12–$0.14/kWh https://www.globalpetrolprices.com/France/electricity_prices...

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because most people in the EU outside of the tech field care more about the welfare policies and overall quality of life than some ambitious tech projects of a few random private companies, from which they're unlikely to directly benefit from, especially when those are located outside of their member state.

Overall quality of life goes down if you just keep cutting up the pie without growing it, especially when you go into debt to buy more pie. The current youth in Europe are the first generation in decades to see worse living standards than their parents; Europeans' disdain for economic growth is already catching up with them.

> The current youth in Europe are the first generation in decades to see worse living standards than their parents

This just isn’t the case in my country and most of Central/Eastern Europe at all. I’m under 30, when my parents were my age, this country had just started recovering from communism.

Besides, there’s more to economy than just AI. If anything, I’d rather see my tax money invested into multiple different fields than having it gambled on a single hyped tech field that might as well turn out to not be so easily profitable or world changing in the end.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#125

I've read the article and I kind of agree with some of the things he's saying. It's more than just AI though. Energy is the big problem and the big problem there is that we're just not ramping up renewables quickly enough. Why? Corruption of course. We had a big leaded 15-20 years ago but the German car manufactorers and British/Dutch oil companies applied a huge amount of political pressure, aided by American intere…

Renewable energy is unreliable without a steady storage capacity and EU would still rely on raw materials for battery production on other countries. Further, regardless of the energy source, what is vital for AI or any other industry is a steady, reliable power source which cannot be provided only through renewables in EU, not only because lack of storage, but also unfavourable geography.

That's only true at the micro level; at the macro level it is surprisingly stable over the EU zone + UK + Norway. There are capacity and interconnect issues but they're small fry. We have a huge amount of capacity for wind and considerable for solar, we just need to get using more of it.

We have one of the largest deposits of rare earth minerals in the world in the EU. Where we suffer is in lack of refining capacity. The US are in a similar situation.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the problem is not the model, but the infrastructure needed to run the model. so yeah, gpus, cpus, network, etc etc

Power is 2-3x as expensive in Europe than American. They're toast.

The cost of power is pretty much irrelevant. The TCO of an AI datacenter is dominated by the capex. Over the lifetime of a DC, the capex will be 10x higher than all the opex combined.

Power matters, but what matters is power availability not cost.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#128
post #126

I am sceptical of the AI world dominance race. The thing is that AI is not winner takes all market. AI models and server space is all fungible. It is very valuable, but no one will hold exclusive AI capabilities in the long run.

Agreed. I’ve switched to local models for many of my simpler workloads because they’re good enough. Coding is still through a frontier model though

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#129
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you’d enjoy being like the free and happy people of Tibet then, eh?

Lesser of two evils etc. How about south america as a counterexample?

Is it lesser?

Up until the 2010s the US was generally pretty good with EU & EU adjacent. It’s likely to return too, as there remains a strong societal will for it.

I ask this - which has the more persistent track record of a free or more free society?

I think recency bias and online discourse has polluted perceptions.

Re: Mistral's CEO: Europe has 2 years to stop becoming America's AI 'vassal state'

#130
post #126

I am sceptical of the AI world dominance race. The thing is that AI is not winner takes all market. AI models and server space is all fungible. It is very valuable, but no one will hold exclusive AI capabilities in the long run.

In the HPC space, it has always been a "winner takes all" market. 90% or more of the business goes to the biggest provider with few exceptions (in terms of dollars, obviously all compute gets used).

And, yeah, quite a bit of that is government having ... suboptimal ... developers who want to run bad code that nobody's allowed to look at. And yes, it is about weapons design, which is why nobody is allowed to look at (and certainly not fix) the code.

I think the idea is that AI will dominate a bunch of industries, from government administration, to intelligence (arguably they have that one already), to software, to insurance, to entertainment (produce 10 new lord of the rings series per day). And the first one to get there will "own" Government administrations, Netflix, Microsoft, Google, OpenAI, ...

If the past 20 years have taught us anything, it's that the first one to have a great popular success wins. Not in one market, on ALL of them.

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