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American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

derekthompson.org

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Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#121

Post by WarOnPrivacy »

IcyWindows wrote: post #86
watwut wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The actual threat of CPS 8s grossly exagerrated here. And the fear is one of the symptoms.

I've had CPS call me up and question me about about play someone observed through a window. It's a real thing.

I was in the process of creating a brochure about our family. It's be available at our front door, to help facilitate CPS agents on their visits. It'd have a map to the fridge and to the kids' bedrooms, the names of their schools and contact numbers for family.

All this due to a disgruntled neighbor who endlessly called cps (anonymously), with a variety of bizarre accusations. I suspect CPS got so sick of seeing us, they eventually ignored the calls.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#122

Post by tsoukase »

It's a good article and, as a father, I experience and certify what it says. It presents the causes of the main observed fact (more time for kids) which happens anywhere in the Western world at least. But it can't go further and explain what general social changes cause all that. For me, in no order, they are:

Financial strains (family disposable income, high cost of living, wealth inequality)

Expand of electronic device use (from TVs to modern ones) and their apps

Convergence of gender roles, making males less masculine

General loss of classical values, promotion of easy life, short term goals and superficial qualities leading to misery and deactivation

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#123

Post by emptysongglass »

emptysongglass wrote: post #116
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #22

> Millennial fathers have roughly tripled the amount of time they spend with kids. I think this really undersells it. My mom parented a few hours a week. My kids (like most) lived under ceaseless 24/7 adulting. The time I spent with my sons was more like a 20x increase over my parents' generation. Past that, it seems like it's taking forever for anyone to notice the radical changes in modern parenting/childhood. Alon…

I agree this is a terrible loss. On the other hand, new dads are actually learning how to feel their feelings, communicate those feelings in a healthy way, and tell their children they love them. Millennial dads were (mostly) a distant mess who for whatever reason saw the expression of feelings as "weak".

I just realized I completely missed the grammar on this one: I meant dads of millenials.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#124

Post by iamthemonster »

lazyasciiart wrote: post #42
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #22

> Millennial fathers have roughly tripled the amount of time they spend with kids. I think this really undersells it. My mom parented a few hours a week. My kids (like most) lived under ceaseless 24/7 adulting. The time I spent with my sons was more like a 20x increase over my parents' generation. Past that, it seems like it's taking forever for anyone to notice the radical changes in modern parenting/childhood. Alon…

> nearly no one seems to have noticed it. I'm very curious how much time you spend talking about parenting and consuming either social media or professional content about parenting, because those topics are so deeply embedded in parenting today that it's like saying "nobody seems to have noticed the internet".

Where I live in Western Australia, it is perfectly normal for 10-year-olds to be getting on their bikes and going round to their friends' houses after school.

The swing towards "Fuck Around And Find Out" parenting has been going for the last ten years here, and everybody gives you rapturous applause when you encourage kids to have their own independent playtime.

I have also never seen a man at a playground get dirty looks, in fact there are more men out with their kids than women on the weekends (fewer during weekdays).

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#125

Post by jaredklewis »

Ancapistani wrote: post #119
jaredklewis wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> testosterone levels have dropped without a solid explanation There is a solid explanation. First, before the adoption of mass spec, studies used a less accurate method of measuring testosterone that overstated testosterone levels. Also, the studies showing the population level decline in testosterone generally controlled for obesity (which naturally lowers testosterone) using BMI. But BMI is a very crude measure. W…

That study appears to be US only, while global studies have shown the effect. For that matter, some _animal_ studies have shown declining testosterone as well. That doesn't seem to be well-studied, but if it holds up it would make me lean toward it being something environmental (e.g. microplastic pollution)

I linked that study because it is particularly interesting because they run the mass spec test on archived blood samples.

But there are other studies and meta analyses which cover other countries and come to the same conclusion.

I think many of the studies claiming to find significant population level decline are older and overstate the issue due to the methodological errors outlined in my previous post. If you are thinking of a particular one, please share a link.

I am not familiar with the research on testosterone levels in animals. In humans, while not conclusory, I do think the evidence suggests that increasing rates of obesity and metabolic syndrome are the proximate cause of testosterone decline.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#126

Post by reverius42 »

jeffbee wrote: post #41
rhubarbtree wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Millennials seem to have their shit together more than any generation since the silent generation, at least in the UK.

Silent Americans are the most fucked up generation ever. They are the ones actually responsible for most of the bullshit that people attribute to Boomers.

Just wait til GenX is elderly.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#127

Post by xboxnolifes »

illiac786 wrote: post #115
purplerabbit wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So confidently stated! My wife had ludicrous options and chose it — what draws you to this conclusion?

Parent said often, not always. Counter examples is an anecdote. I would like to see good statistics on this. And your wife’s opinion on her choices.

The counter example my be anecdotal, but the original claim is also baseless. It's not anecdote vs data, it's anecdote vs nothing.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#128

Post by mchaver »

krapp wrote: post #82
compiler-guy wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the very least, you need a whole society of aunts and uncles and grandparents and cousins, and deep friends to truly do any kind of traditional family structure in the traditional way. Otherwise it's just emulating an extremely narrow portion of the trad that didn't exactly exist in the first place.

I remember when Hillary Clinton said "it takes a village to raise a child" and she was mocked by conservatives and accused of undermining parental rights and wanting governments to control families. And when BLM made it part of their charter to encourage community support for children beyond the typical nuclear unit they were accused of a radical Marxist agenda to "destroy families." For some reason the very concept…

> For some reason the very concept of extended families and community engenders deep anger and hostility from some Americans

I think because excessive individualism plays into the hands of large companies. There is an individualist culture that has naturally grown over time in the US, but it has also been pushed by big corporations because if you can't depend on your neighbors and extended family, you need to spend money to fill the gaps.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#129

Post by munksbeer »

bombcar wrote: post #67
mothballed wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is. It's discouraged and unspoken, but a lot of men don't like spending time with children. I mean for weeks or months, sure, but when you have a kid it drags on for years 24/7 and nothing but having your own child will really reveal to you how that turns out for you. As it turns out, I don't enjoy extended time with children. My bad, but I power through it for the sake of the child. In older times that wo…

I can tell you that as you have more children the time you can spend and need to spend drops - because there’s more of them, but they also play with each other. Three are running around yelling and I can’t even join in, as they want me to be “the base” apparently.

I can't believe I'm asking this, because it isn't even something I would remotely consider (and it is too late anyway), but, is three actually easier than two children in some ways?

I have two children and I find parenting to be utterly draining. They are 4 and 6. They are *constantly* fighting. They play together a bit, but when they do, after 5-10 minutes it leads to real fight where we need to intervene. And they still demand an enormous amount of attention.

It turns out I am one of those fathers with a personality that doesn't deal well with constant sensory overload. I was medicated for ADHD myself as a child and one of my children is AuADHD. It isn't his fault and we're trying to find ways to help him (and everyone else), but his meltdowns make life so, so hard for the whole family. He wants to control and dominate every situation, whether it is his brother or his parents.

I was wondering if the dynamics of three would have made it easier because he couldn't dominate his brother so eaily, or if that would just mean he became the isolated child.

Re: American Dads Became the Parents Their Fathers Never Were

#130

Post by sigseg1v »

mothballed wrote: post #61
watwut wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The actual threat of CPS 8s grossly exagerrated here. And the fear is one of the symptoms.

Here's a few examples that's happened to me personally (1) I didn't personally appear at bus stop, thinking my kid would be able to just walk the short distance from the stop to our house. Nope, school did not let kid off bus, given a timer to show up at the transportation office before child services will be called. (2) Let my kid walk on our own property, someone drives up and starts interrogating them why they are…

Holy shit. I'm so sorry that this happened to you. That's not right.
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