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Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

nature.com

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Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#121

Post by Earw0rm »

throwatdem12311 wrote: post #103

Caffeine is an extremely potent drug. It’s actually kind of crazy to think that a large portion of a country’s population could be “high” on it basically all of the time. And there is a huge industry in place for delivering said drug to as many people as possible by having it available on almost every street corner. And that most people take a fairly non-chalant attitude to giving this drug to kids through sweet drin…

That's normalising clean-ness (i.e. the state of being free of all psychoactive chemicals) perhaps too much.

The original humans adapted to a wide range of diets across the world (one reason why we're such a successful species), but most groups seem to consume mild psychoactives a lot (it's hard not to, so many wild plants have some level of activity) and seek out more powerful ones occasionally and for specific situations.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#122

Post by pdimitar »

randusername wrote: post #115
bayarearefugee wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quitting caffeine after decades of use was a bit of a mixed bag for me in the short term, but positive in the long term. Going caffeine-free made it much easier to lose weight as I have far less cravings for high carbs and sugar now, presumably this is related to the impulsivity impact talked about in the paper. Going caffeine-free also made me very depressed for a while with severe anhedonia, this lasted way longer…

I experienced a similar anhedonia when quitting caffeine. I don't think the caffeine itself was the problem, I think it was just helping a lot more than I knew with the inertia of circling the pit without tottering in. Turns out I needed stimulants from time to time, just not that one.

What stimulants have you landed on? And do you feel they're better for you?

I'm pondering getting a coffee machine at home. 400 EUR is not a sizable investment and one I'd have forgotten about it 3 months but I'm getting cold feet when it gets to committing.

Americano coffee definitely picks me up and is a full net positive for me. But that's only if I drink 2-3 times a week. Not sure how it's going to be if I start getting it every day.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#123

Post by criddell »

Edd314159 wrote: post #89
andor wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on how much caffeine is in your cup. Rather than measuring the size of a cup, I would go by the amount of coffee, as in the weight of the beans, used to brew it. The actual amount of caffeine is not as easy to measure, and even for the same kind of beans, there is natural variation. For a traditional Italian espresso, about 7g of coffee beans are extracted. For a third-wave double espresso, it's usually 18…

There is no realistic scenario where, no matter your extractions or bean selections, 6-10 shots of espresso a day is not an enormous amount of caffeine

A grande americano at Starbucks is a 16 oz drink with three shots of espresso. Have one in the morning and one in the afternoon and you are at six shots of espresso. That doesn't seem all that enormous to me.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#124

Post by amelius »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #38

After habitually consuming caffeine (not in coffee form) daily, usually multiple times a day, for more than a decade, a horrible mental health incident happened to me that forced me to stop it for a while. Afterwards I didn't resume the habit, and so I no longer have a tolerance. This has let me evaluate what caffeine does with fresh eyes, so to say, because I can now consume it occasionally while having many non-caf…

This happened to me with Pepsi cola.

But then I found out I can drink coffee just fine, even 5 cups per day.

Now I'm thinking it was the artificial sweetener.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#125

Post by rpdillon »

criddell wrote: post #123
Edd314159 wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no realistic scenario where, no matter your extractions or bean selections, 6-10 shots of espresso a day is not an enormous amount of caffeine

A grande americano at Starbucks is a 16 oz drink with three shots of espresso. Have one in the morning and one in the afternoon and you are at six shots of espresso. That doesn't seem all that enormous to me.

75mg per shot = 450mg caffeine

That's a bit over the recommended limit of 400mg a day the Mayo Clinic, FDA, etc. recommend. Not sure it it qualifies as 'enormous' or not.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#126

Post by CuriousRose »

orphea wrote: post #85
BatteryMountain wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had the same experience. Caffeine is super addicting, the ritual & habits surrounding it is a potent pull. For myself, it makes me erratic, impulsive, more reactive and agitated. One cup a day puts me on edge, makes me sweat more, makes me more intolerant, makes everything feel too slow. It such a sneaky drug and it can really get under your skin without you realizing how much it changes you.

I don't have the same experience, and I drink one cup of coffee (270 ml) almost every day. No agitation, no impulsiveness. I can drink coffee in late evening (let's say 8 pm) and sleep well. I guess I'm trying to say that we should not project our own experience on others, everyone is different.

In my experience, this is common among people with ADHD (myself, friends with ADHD, family with ADHD, psychologist’s patients anecdotal evidence). YMMV

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#127

Post by Projectiboga »

Here is a fun citation with a brief summary. They suggest regular caffine use lowers your baseline and it just returns you to where you'd be if you weren't dependent.

University of Bristol. "Coffee consumption unrelated to alertness: Stimulating effects may be illusion, study finds." ScienceDaily. ScienceDaily, 3 June 2010. .

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#128

Post by hpeinar »

A very interesting article, I have personal experience with:

> Coffee also affects the gastrointestinal tract. It increases stomach acidity and stimulates the release of hormones that aid digestion. Both caffeinated and decaffeinated coffee promote the contractility of ileal and colonic smooth muscle, helping prevent constipation

As the two times in my adult life I've tried to make an intended break from coffee, it has ended up with almost unbearable stomach pain caused by constipation.

It's good to know that this is not linked to caffeine as I thought, so I will try un-caffinated coffee instead now because I tend to think that my general "tiredness" comes from actual caffeine.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#129

Post by tootie »

arnejenssen wrote: post #95

I am not a coffee drinker, but I met with a friend at a cafe who said he was going to get a cup of insect poison, referring to coffee :)

Caffeine evolved to deter insects. Coffee, tea, chocolate and some other plants all evolved caffeine independently due to similar evolutionary pressure.

Re: Habitual coffee intake shapes the microbiome, modifies physiology and cognition

#130

Post by irthomasthomas »

hpeinar wrote: post #128

A very interesting article, I have personal experience with: > Coffee also affects the gastrointestinal tract. It increases stomach acidity and stimulates the release of hormones that aid digestion. Both caffeinated and decaffeinated coffee promote the contractility of ileal and colonic smooth muscle, helping prevent constipation As the two times in my adult life I've tried to make an intended break from coffee, it h…

Can you actually get caffeine free coffee? I thought most decaf brands where only about 50% less.
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