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Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

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Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#121

Post by amelius »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #116
skybrian wrote: post #12

I guess gigawatts is how we roughly measure computing capacity at the datacenter scale? Also saw something similar here: > Costs and pricing are expressed per “token”, but the published data immediately seems to admit that this is a bad choice of unit because it costs a lot more to output a token than input one. It seems to me that the actual marginal quantity being produced and consumed is “processing power”, which…

It's not really a stable measure of compute, but it's a good indication of burn rate as energy cost is something we closely track in economies and it actually dominates a lot of the cost of operating data centers. At least short term. Over time we'll get more tokens per energy unit and less dollars for the hardware needed per energy unit. Tokens currently is too abstract for a lot of people. They have no concept of t…

We need a Moore's law for tokens, and energy.

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#122

Post by zozbot234 »

MrOrelliOReilly wrote: post #114
bdangubic wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

none of the three are even remote moat

How so? Opus and Sonnet are frontier models which cannot easily be replicated. Compute has real physical constraints which require appropriate procurement at this scale. At least those two points seem like pretty strong moats against the majority of companies.

You don't need to "replicate" Opus and Sonnet, you just need to match their overall performance at lower cost. That's been absolutely doable so far, with a steadily decreasing lag time.

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#123

Post by holografix »

aurareturn wrote: post #88
holografix wrote: post #87

I don’t understand Claude Code’s moat here. What can it do that opencode can’t or couldn’t fairly easily implement?

The moat is in: 1. Opus and Sonnet. 2. Compute capacity. Anthropic has much more of it than your average coding startup. 3. The developing ecosystem around Claude Code.

I don’t think Opus and Sonnet are significantly better than Gemini or ChatGPT. Am I missing something?

It looks to me that Anthropic is one or two Gemmas away from a lot of people using Opus for 20% of hard use cases and letting on-device LLM rip through the code base on a Mac Mini or Studio and OpenCode.

Once Claude Code is not the only game in town and Cowork is made redundant by Google pulling their finger out on integration with Workspace, what else is there for Anthropic?

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#124

Post by zozbot234 »

holografix wrote: post #123
aurareturn wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The moat is in: 1. Opus and Sonnet. 2. Compute capacity. Anthropic has much more of it than your average coding startup. 3. The developing ecosystem around Claude Code.

I don’t think Opus and Sonnet are significantly better than Gemini or ChatGPT. Am I missing something? It looks to me that Anthropic is one or two Gemmas away from a lot of people using Opus for 20% of hard use cases and letting on-device LLM rip through the code base on a Mac Mini or Studio and OpenCode. Once Claude Code is not the only game in town and Cowork is made redundant by Google pulling their finger out on…

On-device agentic use is orders of magnitude harder than simple chatting (which is still slow for SOTA), it uses up a huge amount of context and tokens on reading code and reasoning through it. It's sort of viable if you just set it to work overnight on some completely vibe-coded stuff, but that has very middling results. Giving feedback to the model interactively is completely out of the question.

Where open models can make a difference for agentic use is with third-party inference at scale, which can actually be fast enough for reasonable workflows.

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#125

Post by nopurpose »

blueblisters wrote: post #112
nopurpose wrote: post #109

How is compute shortage to satisfy demand manifested? Obviously they never close sign-ups, so only option is to extended queues? But if demand grows like crazy, then queues should get longer, yet my pro claude plan seems snappy with only occasional retries due to 429.

They have several levers for demand destruction. From Anthropic's POV, I suspect this is least to worst bad - reducing the surface area of "acceptable use" (e.g., blocking third-party tools OpenClaw) - tighter usage limits and more subscription tiers - increasing existing subscription prices - moving to usage based model completely - taking away compute from training next gen models (future demand destruction)

Reduce quality? Like quantizing models or context cache

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#126

Post by delichon »

pepperoni_pizza wrote: post #104
delichon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Measuring data centers in watts is like measuring cars in horsepower. Power isn't a direct measure of performance, but of the primary constraint on performance. When in doubt choose the thermodynamic perspective.

Gigawatts are units of power, gigawatthours are units of energy. The equivalent of cars would be pricing by how much gas you burned, not horsepower.

1 horsepower = 745.7 watts

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#127

Post by rkangel »

itake wrote: post #93
holografix wrote: post #87

I don’t understand Claude Code’s moat here. What can it do that opencode can’t or couldn’t fairly easily implement?

Claude Code can be lower cost. OpenCode: you pay per token. Claude Code: you pay a flat fee.

Claude Code personal or Team: you pay a flat fee

Claude Code Enterprise: you pay per token

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#128

Post by OliverGuy »

hgoel wrote: post #83
Eufrat wrote: post #4

Can someone explain why everything is being marketed in terms of power consumption?

Maybe it's just because the specifics on FLOPs are more complicated, especially given how many different floating point formats are floating around in ML. Even NVIDIA has like 6 different FLOPs numbers on their GPUs nowadays.

And you know Nvidia can't be constent with one format for FLOPs within a single graph, 1,000,000x faster but comparing FP32 to FP8 or NVFP4 and acting like it's the same.

Re: Anthropic expands partnership with Google and Broadcom for next-gen compute

#130

Post by ethbr1 »

nopurpose wrote: post #125
blueblisters wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have several levers for demand destruction. From Anthropic's POV, I suspect this is least to worst bad - reducing the surface area of "acceptable use" (e.g., blocking third-party tools OpenClaw) - tighter usage limits and more subscription tiers - increasing existing subscription prices - moving to usage based model completely - taking away compute from training next gen models (future demand destruction)

Reduce quality? Like quantizing models or context cache

Or reducing default reasoning levels?
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