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Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

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Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#121

Post by tracker1 »

gambiting wrote: post #20
chrismorgan wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I assume 9 is better than 7 right? Right? Oh, the number of times I’ve heard someone assume their five- or ten-year-old machine must be powerful because it’s an i7… no, the i3-14100 (released two years ago) is uniformly significantly superior to the i7-9700 (released five years before that), and only falls behind the i9-9900 in multithreaded performance. Within the same product family and generation, I expect 9 is…

>>Within the same product family and generation, I expect 9 is better than 7 Ah the good old Dell laptop engineering, where the i9 is better on paper, but in reality it throttles within 5 seconds of starting any significant load and the cpu nerfs itself below even i5 performance. Classic Dell move.

Same for the later generation Intel Macbook Pros... The i9 was so bad, and the throttling made it practically unusable for me. If it weren't a work issued laptop, I'd have either returned it, or at least under-volted and under-clocked it so it didn't hiccup every time I did anything at all.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#122

Post by christkv »

stefanfisk wrote: post #56
gambiting wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Within the same product family and generation, I expect 9 is better than 7 Ah the good old Dell laptop engineering, where the i9 is better on paper, but in reality it throttles within 5 seconds of starting any significant load and the cpu nerfs itself below even i5 performance. Classic Dell move.

Apple had the same problem before they launched the M1. Unless your workloads are extremely bursty the i9 MacBook is almost guaranteed to be slower than the base i7.

I still have the i9 macbook pro and its a dog for sure throttles massively

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#123

Post by Dylan16807 »

aurareturn wrote: post #45
chasil wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After their 7/10nm delay, they are bringing 2nm into production. They skipped 5nm and 3nm, and that is indeed an accomplishment. I hope the yeilds are high.

They didn't skip it. They have Intel 7, Intel 4, Intel 3 nodes. Anyways, Intel's names do not equal to the same number on TSMC. They're usually 1 or 1.5 generation behind with the same name. So Intel 3 would be something like TSMC N6.

Wow, I didn't realize Intel was slacking on top of their node rename. Sure their "10nm" was ahead at the time, but if they'd left the numbers alone they'd be a much closer match to everyone else today instead of even further off.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#124

Post by tracker1 »

chrismorgan wrote: post #31
gambiting wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Within the same product family and generation, I expect 9 is better than 7 Ah the good old Dell laptop engineering, where the i9 is better on paper, but in reality it throttles within 5 seconds of starting any significant load and the cpu nerfs itself below even i5 performance. Classic Dell move.

Within the same family and generation, I don’t think this should happen any more. But especially in the past, some laptops were configurable with processors of different generations or families (M, Q, QM, U, so many possibilities) so that the i7 option might have worse real-world performance than the i5 (due to more slower cores).

It's been a cooling problem on a lot of i9 laptops... the CPU will hit thermal peaks, then throttle down, this has an incredibly janky feel as a user... then it spins back up, and down... the performance curves just wacky in general.

Today is almost worse, as the thermal limits will be set entirely different between laptop vendors on the same chips, so you can't even have apples to apples performance expectations from different vendors.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#125

Post by kergonath »

lostlogin wrote: post #103
kergonath wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What about the iBook? That wasn’t tidy. Ebooks or laptops? Back then, there were iBooks (entry-level) and PowerBooks (professional, high performance and expensive). There had been PowerBooks since way back in 1991, well before any ebook reader. I am not sure what your gripe is. > Or the iPhone 9? That didn’t exist. There’s a hole in the series. In what way is it a problem, and how on earth is it similar to the situ…

You were saying that Apple is very consistent. I’m pointing out they aren’t particularly. > It never got weird. After 10.9.5 came 10.10.0. Version numbers are not decimals. They turned one of the numbers into a letter then started numbering again. There was Mac OS 9, then Mac OS X. That got incremented up past 10. You say they don’t mess around with model numbers. Yes they do, with software and hardware. I like using…

> They turned one of the numbers into a letter then started numbering again.

They did not. It has been MacOS X 10.0 through macOS 10.15. In never was X.1 or anything like that.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#126

Post by mminer237 »

justin66 wrote: post #77
gambiting wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But like.....what for example. As a normal windows PC user, what kind of software can I run that will benefit from that NPU at all?

They're going to find a way to accelerate the Windows start menu with it.

Oh boy, instead of building an efficient index or optimizing the start menu or its built-in web browser, they're adding more power usage to make the computer randomly guess what I want returned since they still can't figure out how to return search results of what you actually typed.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#127

Post by ajross »

hnuser123456 wrote: post #120
ajross wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> cost cutting on Lunar Lake It's... the launch vehicle for a new process. Literally the opposite of "cost cutting", they went through the trouble of tooling up a whole fab over multiple years to do this. Will 18A beat TSMC and save the company? We don't know. But they put down a huge bet that it would, and this is the hand that got dealt. It's important, not something to be dismissed.

Lunar Lake integrated DRAM on the package, which was faster and more power efficient, this reverts that. They also replaced part of the chip from being sourced from TSMC to from themselves. And if their foundry is competitive, they should be shaking other foundry customers down the way TSMC is. If they have actually mostly caught up to TSMC, props, but also, I wish they hadn't given up on EUV for so long. Instead the…

I don't see how any of that substantiates "Panther Lake and 18A are just cost cutting efforts vs. Lunar Lake". It mostly just sounds like another boring platform flame.

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#128

Post by SirMaster »

gambiting wrote: post #22
vbezhenar wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These processors have NPU (Neural Processing Unit) which is supposed to accelerate some small local neural networks. Nvidia RTX GPUs have much more powerful NPUs, so it's more about laptops without discrete GPU.

But like.....what for example. As a normal windows PC user, what kind of software can I run that will benefit from that NPU at all?

Windows Recall?

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#129

Post by Marsymars »

KeplerBoy wrote: post #24
vbezhenar wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These processors have NPU (Neural Processing Unit) which is supposed to accelerate some small local neural networks. Nvidia RTX GPUs have much more powerful NPUs, so it's more about laptops without discrete GPU.

Are we calling tensor cores NPUs now?

How did we end up with Tensor Cores and a Tensor SoC from two different companies?

Re: Intel Core Ultra Series 3 Debut as First Built on Intel 18A

#130

Post by hnuser123456 »

ajross wrote: post #127
hnuser123456 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lunar Lake integrated DRAM on the package, which was faster and more power efficient, this reverts that. They also replaced part of the chip from being sourced from TSMC to from themselves. And if their foundry is competitive, they should be shaking other foundry customers down the way TSMC is. If they have actually mostly caught up to TSMC, props, but also, I wish they hadn't given up on EUV for so long. Instead the…

I don't see how any of that substantiates "Panther Lake and 18A are just cost cutting efforts vs. Lunar Lake". It mostly just sounds like another boring platform flame.

I'll let Intel speak for themselves here:

https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/cpus/lunar-lakes-...

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