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Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

tomshardware.com

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Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#121

Post by michalhosna »

brenainn wrote: post #41

A good time to point out https://github.com/Hypfer/Valetudo . I haven't tried it personally because my particular model of vacuum has some complicated and potentially destructive procedure to get the required access, but there's quite a few models where it can be installed easily.

I am super happy with Valetudo.

Since the robots got cameras and microphones, it's a no-go for me to have it in my home connected to some cloud.

It's little bit challenging to orient oneself in the project (tip: read a couple of the last release notes), but once you do, it's great.

I bought a new robot vacuum that was specifically recommended by the Valetudo project (Dreame L10s Pro Ultra Heat). The rooting was straightforward and non-destructive. The robot works great.

And the usage is much better even for non-developer people (i.e. my wife), as the UI is simple, not constantly changing under your hands, no ads, no upseling. It's a tool as it should be.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#122

Post by Zigurd »

ethin wrote: post #62

IMO a company should lose all control over technology once you've purchased it. Doesn't matter if it's "smart" or not. If the company wants to do something like telemetry, they can buy a license from you for that data. See how they like it when the tables are flipped.

Advocating regulation against dark patterns is tantamount to summoning the antichrist. All the money will run away to Galt's Gulch, or maybe Texas.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#123

Post by 334f905d22bc19 »

goku12 wrote: post #94
userbinator wrote: post #66

First of all, it's Android Debug Bridge, which gives him full root access to the vacuum, wasn't protected by any kind of password or encryption. Good. You bought it, you own it. (I have no skin in this game --- my vacuum is as dumb as they come, and can be fixed with basic machine shop tools.)

> (I have no skin in this game --- my vacuum is as dumb as they come, and can be fixed with basic machine shop tools.) The real question is, is that still an option? If it is, then for how long? Sadly, there are several other product lines that have entirely crossed that line a while ago.

If the day ever comes where this is not an option anymore, then I will just clean my house with a broom. Same thing goes for washing machines. If I can't buy one without internet, then I will clean my clothes by hand.

Smart things are the worst shit ever. They make everything take longer, given the debugging/upgrading overhead. Not buying into that. What would be smart, would be a washing machine that cleans, dries, sorts and folds my clothes. Without talking to facebook. I would buy into that, but I don't need to share my washing machine status on instagram

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#124

Post by toomanyrichies »

StarGrit wrote: post #90
raphman wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "most idiotic devices anyone could own" Ever been to Chesterton's Fence? Hypothetically, some people who own such an idiotic device might have pets that bring in lots of dirt from the fields, lose lots of hair, and get a little bit agitated by the normal vacuum cleaner but more or less ignore the robot vacuum.

Cats aren't that bothered by vacuum cleaners unless you come at them with it and they normally just run into another room. Never seen a dog that bothered by them.

Oh, well if you’ve never seen one…

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#125

Post by sidewndr46 »

kdmtctl wrote: post #37
sidewndr46 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't own the software on the device, they do. If they choose to revoke that license, that is their choice.

In EU you have the right to use bundled software as long as you own the appliance. Not sure this is true for US.

How does that work? What if the company licenses technology from company A to build product B, but the license is only good for 2 years? What happens 2 years after you buy product B?

Also doesn't Apple, Google, & other remove features from people's smartphones after release all the time in the EU?

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#126

Post by sidewndr46 »

awefasdf wrote: post #21
sidewndr46 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't own the software on the device, they do. If they choose to revoke that license, that is their choice.

I own the device and all of its storage. The exact state of that storage is my business and precisely no one else's.

You can own as many storage devices as you wish, it doesn't give you the right to make copies of others works and use them without license.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#127

Post by jagged-chisel »

Xelbair wrote: post #84
morsch wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They seem to own 75% of the market, and I think you can get pretty much every book on every device, right? Of course your existing library is locked-in; ideally, that'd be illegal.

Worse - they actually can remove books that you've purchased. Not only revoke license for future downloads - but actually remove them from your device. Ironically they did that to 1984 book.

The “good news” is you can get a refund for titles that are removed. But you have to ask for it.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#128

Post by kdmtctl »

sidewndr46 wrote: post #125
kdmtctl wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In EU you have the right to use bundled software as long as you own the appliance. Not sure this is true for US.

How does that work? What if the company licenses technology from company A to build product B, but the license is only good for 2 years? What happens 2 years after you buy product B? Also doesn't Apple, Google, & other remove features from people's smartphones after release all the time in the EU?

This is not legal to sell a finished product which has a license time bomb, I suppose.

Google and Apple can change the future set but they do not brick the device which was discussed and it works as advertised at the moment of purchase.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#129

Post by potato3732842 »

smt88 wrote: post #115
godelski wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you frame it that way you need to offer the other version. I do wonder how many people would buy non-spy versions of devices given the option. More specifically, what that differential in price would be too. At worst it would be interesting to have a price explicitly stating what our data is worth. Many people actually internalize that it's not that valuable, but doing this would make it explicit.

> I do wonder how many people would buy non-spy versions of devices given the option. Depending on the discount for the spyware version, I'd guess close to zero. The general public has become completely numb to being spied on. It's hard to get someone to give up $50 (a real cost) for something nebulous like "very slightly less of your life is known by marketing companies".

You vastly over-estimate the average ROI per user being spied on.

Re: Vacuum bricked after user blocks data collection – user mods it to run anyway

#130

Post by Telaneo »

charcircuit wrote: post #15

I suspect this is not the full story. Why would someone waste their time manually disabling a device? That makes me think that this device was doing something malicous to their servers, enough to trip an alert.

> Why would someone waste their time manually disabling a device?

What what makes you think it was manual?

> That makes me think that this device was doing something malicous to their servers, enough to trip an alert.

Sounds like a them problem, and not a problem that should affect the consumer (beyond losing functionality directly tied to the server, which bricking of any kind goes far beyond)

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