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China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

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Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#121

Post by jacobolus »

hmm37 wrote: post #103
jacobolus wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese CO₂ emissions per capita are only about 60% as much as the USA, but in the past 25 years US per capita emissions have dropped by about a third and Chinese emissions per capita have almost tripled and are still rising rapidly. Considering that China is about 4 times as populous as the US, this is a huge problem for the world. (US emissions are also a huge problem; we all need for them to decrease very quickly.…

Is the per capita still rising rapidly? China's CO2 growth levels have already started leveling off, and actually showed a slight decline as of late. https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-clean-energy-just-put-c...

That would be great. I was looking at https://ourworldindata.org/co2-emissions

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#122

Post by GenerocUsername »

mtmickush wrote: post #106
throwawaymaths wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The earth doesn't give a shit about per capita, and us and eu are net reducing CO2 emissions since 2014 (even during trump I)

The earth isn't a person. I think it seems valid to consider the harm and or benefits being caused on a per person basis. Why should an individual in the US be allowed to release more CO2 emissions than an individual in China?

Yes thats right.

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#123

Post by GenerocUsername »

voxelghost wrote: post #82
AuthAuth wrote: post #46

This sounds big but its less than the bare minimum required. Their coal emissions are insane. In my opinion its all anyone should be talking about when it comes to climate change.

Well they're releasing 9.2ton CO2 per Capita, the US is releasing 13.5ton CO2 per Capita. And this while the US and the rest of the world is doing all of their manufacturing in China.

Maybe the rest of the world should stop doing their manufacturing in china.

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#124

Post by amalcon »

throwawaymaths wrote: post #88
lbrito wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you tell everyone what their per capita emission is? While you're at it, compare that with the US per capita emissions. Also let us know the accumulated emissions for China and US in the last 50 years. Thanks.

The earth doesn't give a shit about per capita, and us and eu are net reducing CO2 emissions since 2014 (even during trump I)

The earth also doesn't care about national borders, so why are national numbers more useful in this regard?

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#125

Post by ben_w »

vasco wrote: post #99
jacobolus wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Air conditioning is a relatively small part of global CO₂ emissions (3%); you should be more worried about heating. I would expect air conditioning to also be among the easier energy uses to match with solar power as we go forward. Better building design and more efficient AC devices also make a huge difference.

The point is about quality of life.

There's many ways to achieve improved quality of life. Our fancy-insulated new German house with triple glazing and a heat pump used an average of 250 W grid power last month, despite our PV being (1) a Balkonkraftwerk and therefore only 800 W peak, (2) summer's over, lots of clouds now, and (3) in a very sub-optimal location due to a builder's skip. (Still, the neighbours have trimmed the hedge last weekend and the skip has now gone…)

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#126

Post by miroljub »

GenerocUsername wrote: post #123
voxelghost wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well they're releasing 9.2ton CO2 per Capita, the US is releasing 13.5ton CO2 per Capita. And this while the US and the rest of the world is doing all of their manufacturing in China.

Maybe the rest of the world should stop doing their manufacturing in china.

It's called China, not china.

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#127

Post by School-Cotton »

mulmen wrote: post #80
lbrito wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you tell everyone what their per capita emission is? While you're at it, compare that with the US per capita emissions. Also let us know the accumulated emissions for China and US in the last 50 years. Thanks.

Per capita emissions aren’t relevant to climate impact. Neither are relative emissions between countries. This is a global issue.

Per capita emissions are relevant in the sense that if China broke into ten separate countries tomorrow, with each new country maintaining their current level of emissions, the effect on the planet would be the same even though an entity called “China” is no longer at the top of the leaderboard.

There is some per capita carbon emissions budget such that if each human on earth stayed within that budget, climate change could be mitigated[0]. The average Chinese person exceeds that budget, but does so by significantly less than the average American. So the average American is more at fault for climate change than the average Chinese person is.

Of course, your second claim, that this is a global issue, is correct. But if we solved the global issue in a fair way, China would still emit a few times more CO2 than the US.

0: “Mitigated” rather than totally solved, because to go back to pre-industrial temperatures the budget would have to be negative. But let’s say we’re talking about staying within 2C or some similar goal.

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#128

Post by chrisweekly »

Mistletoe wrote: post #87
munk-a wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And nuclear power - they have a large carbon deficit to make up so you shouldn't think of them as a green economy by any measure but... I think their strongest advantage is that there is a strong environmental pressure within the country and (while industrialists will be industrialists) there is no faction or movement within China that is dedicated to an anti-environmental agenda. There's a lot of work to be done and…

I wonder what kind of forest China is making? I was watching a really fascinating PBS documentary on Kanopy and it was talking about a lot of the planting efforts haven't been very good worldwide because planting a monoculture of trees doesn't do much and an old forest with tons of diversity stores twice as much carbon or more, which I thought was neat. So protecting existing forests is much better from a climate cha…

Given the goal is to introduce trees to prevent desertification, in this case the relative benefits of old growth are irrelevant.

Re: China has added forest the size of Texas since 1990

#130

Post by ben_w »

amalcon wrote: post #124
throwawaymaths wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The earth doesn't give a shit about per capita, and us and eu are net reducing CO2 emissions since 2014 (even during trump I)

The earth also doesn't care about national borders, so why are national numbers more useful in this regard?

Governments have a lot of control over things within their borders, and are held responsible when bad things happen within them.
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