Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

science.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 245 posts

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#121

Post by Marsymars »

tavavex wrote: post #54
killingtime74 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't worry about the law think about the practical impact. It's now completely legal to ignore the patent in Canada so the price in Canada will plummet. Canadian pharmacies can legally sell it and Americans (and all other foreigners for that matter) traveling there can legally buy it. Unlike the criminal law, Novo nordisk would have to go after every single person individually and make the case that they are infring…

> Canadian pharmacies can legally sell it and Americans (and all other foreigners for that matter) traveling there can legally buy it. Well, about that... Aren't all variants of medications like these prescription-only? And in Canada you can't fill a foreign prescription without having a local doctor sign off on it, as far as I know.

Depends on province. From my best reading, pharmacists in Alberta with prescribing authority can directly prescribe all schedule 1 drugs themselves.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#122

Post by aardvarkr »

llm_nerd wrote: post #105
rahimnathwani wrote: post #20

AIUI, because they let the patent expire, the drug was not subject to price regulation by the government. So they could charge whatever. And during most of that time, they were still protected by 'data exclusivity' which means that any generic producer could not get approved without doing their own clinical trials, until 8 years had passed. So they gave up some period of exclusivity in return for being able to charge…

>And during most of that time Most of what time? The patent just expired a few months ago. Generics are now ramping up because the patent expired, not because of some hypothetical eight year clinical trials. And for that matter, generics of existing ingredients and dosages do not have to repeat clinical trials anyways, which is one of the big reasons generics are a lot less expensive. This hypothesis seems retconned…

This article is saying that the patent elapsed in 2018 because thy didn’t pay the $250 to renew the patent. Instead they relied on “data exclusivity” which means their trial data is exclusively theirs and anyone who wants to sell in Canada must first run safety trials of their own at a huge expense. It’s just as good as a patent but has a shorter window of exclusivity.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#123

Post by aardvarkr »

1oooqooq wrote: post #118
vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

being free means taxpayers will pay. and being on the public system means it will be prescribed only for health risk, just like plastic surgery already is. you don't see people getting nose jobs just because.

Generics are so cheap and easy to make that they can reasonably justify that it will save the government money by making the population healthier. Just think about how much less heart disease and cancer and every other obesity-affected disease costs the taxpayer.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#124

Post by bparsons »

c2h5oh wrote: post #50
rootusrootus wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're going to go for a two year supply, it's probably better to just risk shipping it. You're not going to come home with that much without it getting confiscated, and you're way more likely to be searched individually than a typical package is.

With de minimis for US-bound packages suspended I suspect way more packages are inspected than used to be.

Higher enforcement demands probably lead to more stuff slipping through.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#125

Post by [deleted] »

rootusrootus wrote: post #24
gpt5 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Canadian manufacturers (Sandoz and Apotex) are preparing to launch their own generic versions in early 2026. I bet many Americans would travel to Canada to buy it there (despite the legality concerns). The medications lasts 2 years in a refrigerator.

If you're going to go for a two year supply, it's probably better to just risk shipping it. You're not going to come home with that much without it getting confiscated, and you're way more likely to be searched individually than a typical package is.

[deleted]

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#126

Post by aardvarkr »

pedalpete wrote: post #3

I thought I had a decent handle on patent law, but maybe I'm missing something here. Yes, the patent won't be valid for Canada, but you can't import a product into the US which would infringe on a US patent. So, though there may be a small amount that would slip through the cracks, it isn't as if anyone in the US can now manufacture Semaglutide and distribute it. Canada is such a small market, that many companies don…

Medical tourism is a huge industry. A 3 month supply costs more than $3k in the USA. A flight to Canada costs $300 and takes a few hours of your time. I’d definitely do it if I was taking the drug.

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#127

Post by matheusmoreira »

vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

SUS doesn't have a good track record when it comes to offering modern drugs and treatments. It takes years if not decades for medications to be covered, even when generics are available. Patients often had to go to court with documents from their doctor in order to make things happen. I've lost count of how many patients I've helped get their treatments... And now the supreme court has closed the door on them.

Still, after dapagliflozin I'm ready to believe it. There's also the fact semaglutide will straight up win votes for politicians that provide it.

I expect it to mirror the evolution of dapagliflozin in SUS: it will be offered unconditionally at first, then as they start to feel the weight of the costs involved they'll start imposing conditions and forcing patients to go through endless bureaucracy to get their medication. Age requirements, comorbity requirements, obnoxious paperwork that "justifies" the need for such a drug. Oh I'll gladly fill out those forms...

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#128

Post by [deleted] »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #99
chronos00 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US residents can buy medicines abroad the FDA link says personal importation is allowed as long as the medicines are FDA approved and are not being imported for commercial purposes. Now in the context of the original post maybe generic versions of Ozempic won't technically be FDA approved yet if the company that produces it has to wait for the US patent to expire.

The FDA approved version may be significantly cheaper to compete with the generic brands. I also wonder if only the "active ingredients" need to be FDA approved, and the packaging is irrelevant?

[deleted]

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#129

Post by kristianp »

dghlsakjg wrote: post #92
rahimnathwani wrote: post #20

AIUI, because they let the patent expire, the drug was not subject to price regulation by the government. So they could charge whatever. And during most of that time, they were still protected by 'data exclusivity' which means that any generic producer could not get approved without doing their own clinical trials, until 8 years had passed. So they gave up some period of exclusivity in return for being able to charge…

The price in Canada is ~$175 USD month for name brand Ozempic where I am with no coupons, or other discounts. I see prices in the US around $800+/month. That is significantly cheaper than the US, and cheaper than other GLP-1 class drugs up here, arguably reasonable. Is the supposition that they would have been forced to charge even less? If so, why are their competitors who kept their patents not charging more? Count…

Does the government/medical insurance subsidise that price though?

Re: Novo Nordisk's Canadian Mistake

#130

Post by UltraSane »

1oooqooq wrote: post #118
vitorgrs wrote: post #31

In Brazil it will expire in July 2026. It's pretty relevant as it's kinda already announced they will put the generics on the public health care (SUS) for free... Which is big deal as an Ozempic shot costs almost the same as the minimum wage. This year they already did an analysis to include Ozempic, but it was denied, probably because of the cost difference... But they were trying on justice to extend the patent...

being free means taxpayers will pay. and being on the public system means it will be prescribed only for health risk, just like plastic surgery already is. you don't see people getting nose jobs just because.

Why wouldn't it be prescribed to morbidly obese people?
Post reply on HN