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Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

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Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#121

Post by amelius »

wongarsu wrote: post #106
lisperforlife wrote: post #11

I think you can get much farther with dedicated servers. I run a couple of nodes on Hetzner. The performance you get from a dedicated machine even if it is a 3 year old machine that you can get on server auction is absolutely bonkers and cannot be compared to VMs. The thing is that most of the server hardware is focused towards high core count, low clock speed processors that optimize for I/O rather than compute. It…

> I would love to know if they are any north-american (particularly canadian) companies that can compete with price and the quality of service like Hetzner. In a thread two days ago https://ioflood.com/ was recommended as US-based alternative

But I'm looking more for "compute flood" ...

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#122

Post by dotancohen »

sergioisidoro wrote: post #86

I really liked Hetzner but I got burned by one issue. I had some personal projects running there and the payment method failed. Automated email communications also failed among so much spam and email notifications I receive, and when I noticed the problem they had wiped all my data without possibility of recovery. It was a wake up moment for me about keeping billing in shape, but also made me understand that a cloud…

  > It was a wake up moment for me about keeping billing in shape
It should be a wake up moment about keeping backups as well.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#123

Post by jgalt212 »

breadislove wrote: post #19

Hetzner is really great until you try to scale with them. We started building our service on top of Hetzner and had couple 100s of VMs running and during peak time we had to scale them to over 1000 VMs. And here couple of problems started, you get pretty often IPs which are black listed, so if you try to connect to services hosted by Google, AWS like S3 etc. you can't reach them. Also at one point there were no VMs a…

1000 VMs?

So you have approx 1MM concurrent customers? That's a big number. You should definitely be able to get preferred pricing from AWS at that scale.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#124

Post by OutOfHere »

vidarh wrote: post #117
PeterStuer wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a substantiated source for the "12x the unfair risk of account termination without warning". I tried looking for it but all I could find were unsubstantiated grapevine (I heard they ...) posts with lots of people stating the opposite.

They're cheap, so I'd expect they get a substantially higher proportion of users who might think their account termination is unfair, but that were actually flouting the rules, so I wouldn't be surprised if there were a higher proportion of claims of unfair account termination... I've recommended Hetzner to people since 2008-2009, and know lots of people who use it, and I've never heard first-hand accounts of termina…

If you haven't read first-hand reports, then you haven't read all that much. If you search on Reddit, you may see many reports. It happened to me personally after I started using their CPU at nearly 100% for about two months. That's a report for you. They're cheap because they don't actually want people using what they're paying for. This is a theme that I have seen with German services.

Speaking of their rules, those are a bit insane too. Speaking of "flouting rules", any prospective user should think about whether it's okay for a cloud vendor to keep spying on which processes the user is running, even without a court order; it is not okay.

If you keep moving the goalpost, then you will understand nothing. You might as well be an employee of Hetzner.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#125

Post by Qasaur »

Hetzner is great for dedicated servers, but for those of us who need smaller-scale secure/confidential VMs I'm afraid that there isn't really any other choice than hyperscalers.

Does anyone know if there is a VM vendor that sits somewhere in between a dedicated server host like Hetzner in terms of performance + cost-effectiveness and AWS/GCP in terms of security?

Basically TPM/vTPM + AMD SEV/SEV-SNP + UEFI Secure Boot support. I've scoured the internet and can't seem to find anyone who provides virtualised trusted computing other than AWS/GCP. Hetzner does not provide a TPM for their VMs, they do not mention any data-in-use encryption, and they explicitly state that they do not support UEFI secure boot - all of these are critical requirements for high-assurance use cases.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#126

Post by deaux »

lisperforlife wrote: post #11

I think you can get much farther with dedicated servers. I run a couple of nodes on Hetzner. The performance you get from a dedicated machine even if it is a 3 year old machine that you can get on server auction is absolutely bonkers and cannot be compared to VMs. The thing is that most of the server hardware is focused towards high core count, low clock speed processors that optimize for I/O rather than compute. It…

On a similar note, I'm looking for a "Hetzner, but in APAC, particularly East Asia". I've struggled to find good options for any of JP, TW or KR.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#127

Post by [deleted] »

sergioisidoro wrote: post #86

I really liked Hetzner but I got burned by one issue. I had some personal projects running there and the payment method failed. Automated email communications also failed among so much spam and email notifications I receive, and when I noticed the problem they had wiped all my data without possibility of recovery. It was a wake up moment for me about keeping billing in shape, but also made me understand that a cloud…

[deleted]

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#128

Post by joshstrange »

CaptainOfCoit wrote: post #102
codethief wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would love to know if they are any north-american (particularly canadian) companies that can compete with price and the quality of service like Hetzner FWIW, Hetzner has two data centers in the US, in case you're just looking for "Hetzner quality but in the US", not for "American/Canadian companies similar to Hetzner".

IIRC, Hetzners dedicated instances are only available in their German and Finnish data centers, not anywhere else sadly :/

This is correct, they only offer VPS in the US.

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#129

Post by likium »

CuriouslyC wrote: post #6

I use Hetzner for this reason, but there are caveats. They're great but their uptime isn't as good as AWS and they don't have great region coverage. I strongly advise people to pair them with Cloudflare. Use Hetzner for your core with K8s, and use R2/D1/KV with Container Durable Objects to add edge coprocessing. I also like to shard customer data to individual DOs, this takes a ton of scaling pressure off your data l…

If customer data is considered edge, then what’s core?

Re: Migrating from AWS to Hetzner

#130

Post by vidarh »

CaptainOfCoit wrote: post #22
jokethrowaway wrote: post #14

Having deployed servers well before AWS was a thing, AWS alwyas felt incredibly overpriced. The only benefit you get is reliability, temporary network issues on AWS are not a thing. On DigitalOcean they are fairly bad (I lose thousands of requests almost every month and I get pennies in credit back when I complain - while my users churning cost way more), on Hetzner I've heard mixed reviews. Some people complains, so…

> Having deployed servers well before AWS was a thing, AWS alwyas felt incredibly overpriced. Yeah, I remember when AWS first appeared, and the value proposition was basically "It's expensive but you can press a button and a minute later you have a new instance, so we can scale really quickly". For the companies that know more or less the workload they have during a week don't really get any benefits, just more expen…

You'll even see people in a lot of the HN threads on the subject refusing to believe AWS is expensive, even in the face of a lot of us with expensive (EDIT: meant "extensive". but will leave it there as the tpo is also apt...) experience running systems on both AWS and alternatives.

The biggest innovation AWS delivered was to convince engineers they are cheap, while wresting control of provisioning away from the people with actual visibility into the costs.

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