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The $25k car is going extinct?

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Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#121

Post by ARandomerDude »

throwaway173738 wrote: post #108

Is anyone else thinking of buying a used panel van instead of a pickup now that they’re so tall you need a ladder to climb into the bed?

I have one and it’s awesome. You also don’t have to worry about someone snatching items out of the bed.

The biggest downsides are (1) I’m reluctant to put anything gross back there (vs throwing a trash bag in the bed like I used to with my truck), and (2) people see a van, assume you’ll drive obnoxiously slowly, and preemptively cut you off in traffic lest they get stuck behind you.

Overall, the pros outweigh those 2 cons for me.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#123

Post by nradov »

autobodie wrote: post #17
snovymgodym wrote: post #7

It's pretty simple (in the US, can't speak for elsewhere). There are 2 big factors at play: 1. Margins. Manufacturers make huge margins on expensive vehicles and very slim margins on cheap vehicles. The numbers differ, but I think even in the lead up to the 2008 crisis automakers had to sell 5-10 "econobox" cars to make the profit they made on one luxury car, SUV, or truck. 2. Normalization of debt. For many American…

the interest on those loans is maddening

Why? Auto loan interest rates are currently below the historical average.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#124

Post by zeroq »

Last year we bought a car.

While not being a petrol head I was still living in a lala land where you could buy a brand new car for 10k EUR. Nothing fancy, just "a car". Obviously it turned out to be not true.

After some digging it turned out that in the last 10 years the price of cars went double. Literally double. Same car, like Fiat Panda, with the same engine and configuration, that ten years was worth one potato is now worth exactly two potato.

Long story short, the entry level car now costs close to 25k EUR. [1]

But here's the kicker.

While subvenstions seem to fail in most cases for regular people - like gvt giving people money to buy apartements equals to apartments being equally more expensive - it seems to work wonders for automotive thanks to Chinese.

EU offers up to 10k EUR subvention for electric cars and with that in mind you can get something like BYD Dolphin for slighly less than 20k EUR. Which is mind blowing. The car is comparable to Volvo XC40. Of course this is just an example and there is plentiful of other options.

[1] If you're not familiar or comfortable with EUR just think 1 EUR is 1 USD and you'll be fine.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#125

Post by neogodless »

mouse_ wrote: post #5

Dealership near me has got some 2024-25 model Mitsubishis for like 19k new. They look pretty sweet.

Chevrolet Trax can be found between $20-21k USD but... when I look at inventory, nothing within ~75 miles is under $25k.

Not a horrible vehicle for the price.

Mazda 3 used to be a $20k car (and even less before that) but now starts just over $24k (sedan) / $25k (hatchback).

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#126

Post by scottbez1 »

beeflet wrote: post #102
jfengel wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never seen the bed of a Cybertruck. Not a dig at the vehicle; that's a different thing. Rather, I notice that this truck doesn't seem to spend much time as a, ya know, truck. With other trucks it's less obvious because they don't have a built in bed cover. I suspect many of them also spent very little time trucking, at least here in this suburb. Perhaps it's different in more agricultural areas.

Usually I would consider such a large truck to be wasteful, but because it's electric you aren't really burning up a ton of extra fuel.

This is such an odd statement. Just because it's electric doesn't mean there's no concept of efficiency.

Large EVs are pretty silly for exactly that efficiency reason - they may have "400" miles of range, but they do so by packing the biggest possible battery which weighs a ton, wasting even more range per kilowatt-hour beyond the worse aerodynamics.

And then because the battery is so massive, it takes way longer to charge for the same range, so now you need a higher current charger at home and maybe even need to upgrade your home electric service instead of just using a standard 15A circuit to top up a small EV every night enough for a typical day's commute.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#127

Post by dzhiurgis »

Gigachad wrote: post #97
dzhiurgis wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have example of places with density similar to US where public transport works well? Australia has some in urban centres, but otherwise car centric. Same in NZ. Elecric bus to my place costs 8x more than driving EV (before it was taxed)

Australia kind of gives you the choice. The inner city areas have great PT, great public spaces and some awesome outdoor walkable retail/food streets. But then you've also got the outer suburbs which is a hellscape similar to the US. It's also not that expensive to rent inner city or buy an apartment. The outer suburbs mostly exist because people have a mentality of invest in land at any cost, even if it means living…

ChatGPT says it's either only 5.6% or 27% (which is pretty good) for Sydney.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#128

Post by nradov »

paxys wrote: post #38

One fact not mentioned in the article - Americans now owe $1.64 trillion in auto loans, and cars make up 9% of all consumer debt in the country. In fact we now owe more on cars than student loans. The average loan term is rising - almost 6 years now. 60-day delinquency on auto loans is at 6.6%, the highest ever recorded, and is as high as 9% in some states. So while car prices keep going up, people also keep going de…

Sure, status is a factor. But for people who do a lot of driving, having a nice car really benefits their quality of life. No one wants to spend hours every day in a miserable little penalty box.

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#129

Post by SoftTalker »

aorloff wrote: post #74

Nobody else has said it so I guess I will. The reason the US car industry does not want a $25k car is that the financing opportunities are crap for a car of this low cost. In the same way that airlines exist to offer you a miles based credit card, the US car dealerships survive by offering you a loan for the car. Or perhaps, a car to go with your structured finance opportunity.

Buy the best used car you can afford for cash and forget all that dealership nonsense

Re: The $25k car is going extinct?

#130

Post by tricolon »

zeroq wrote: post #124

Last year we bought a car. While not being a petrol head I was still living in a lala land where you could buy a brand new car for 10k EUR. Nothing fancy, just "a car". Obviously it turned out to be not true. After some digging it turned out that in the last 10 years the price of cars went double. Literally double. Same car, like Fiat Panda, with the same engine and configuration, that ten years was worth one potato…

I'd never seen the word "subvention" before. Today I learned it's another way to say "subsidy".
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