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Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

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Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#121

Post by joshstrange »

joseda-hg wrote: post #119
joshstrange wrote: post #59

> System resources ... the requirements are much higher than they need to be They don't mention the requirements directly because people would laugh them out of the room. For hardware (aside from the TPM): 1 gigahertz (GHz) or faster with 2 or more cores on a compatible 64-bit processor, 4 gigabytes (GB), 64 GB or larger storage device. That is "higher than they need to be"? I don't think so. That's the absolute _flo…

At work we have some old computers which entire existence is running a legacy program from back when software didn't have gigs to spare Those computers efectively have fixed requirements measured in a few megabytes + Whatever Windows needs This eventually will mean that either those apps get rewriten for no good reason and moved to other platforms, or they get stuck on 'unsupported OS, AirGapped from as much as possi…

Air-gap or firewall them then and move on. Nothing says you have to update Windows unless they are online.

There are plenty of ancient computers running DOS or older still, nothing stops them from working if you don't need features of the newer OS.

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#122

Post by christophilus »

account42 wrote: post #100
christophilus wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My 2cents: use Fedora. Or, if you're technically savvy, Arch. I slightly prefer Arch simply because: - Firefox is up to date (Fedora is often 2 weeks late on security patches) - No upgrade cycle. Just `pacman -Syu` on a regular cadence, or whatever you're comfy with. When you go with the vanilla install of a major distro, I find you simply run into fewer shenanigans.

I strongly suggest considering a community-run distro instead of one mainly controlled by one corporation unless you desperately want to experience a Microsoft 2.0. IBM is not a charity, they will extract value from their investments.

Yeah. This is another reason I like Arch.

You do need to read the docs, though. Arch doesn't come with a firewall installed, etc out of the box. It really is a distro that is what you make of it.

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#123

Post by stby »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #108

"Much of this sluggishness, or "lag," comes from Microsoft adding ever-more advertising and tracking." Those replying may or may not find objectionable (a) "sluggishness", (b) "ever-more advertising and tracking" or (c) both (a) and (b) Even if a default Windows install was fast, some people might still object to (b)

Is this even true? I am strongly opposed to ads and tracking in my OS for other reasons, but surely the performance impact is barely measurable.

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#124

Post by kbolino »

nottorp wrote: post #117
kbolino wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all malware is ransomware. "They" will absolutely push more locked down computers, indeed this has become the norm in many areas of computing already, like smartphones, tablets, and video game consoles. For that same regular user, though, this is irrelevant: they're never going to install a different operating system. A computer once compromised by a bootkit is also e-waste. It can never be trusted again. Now, I…

Responsability would mean no services open to the internet by default and not running arbitrary code from any random web site though. What you're describing is more like security theater. Does the TPM protect grandma from malicious javascript? :)

"Services open to the Internet" is more of a 2000s problem than a modern problem. Operating systems default to being a lot less trusting of local networks today, and nearly every place you'd connect to WiFi already has a router with a "drop all unsolicited packets" policy. MITM is the big risk here, and the best way to address it is by using secure protocols (HTTPS, SSH, etc.) everywhere.

Mandatory code signing for web sites would go a long way to addressing some of the most common types of exploits we see today, and that doesn't require a TPM. I'd love to see it, but it is going to require some infrastructure and enforcement to work, and it too could become user-hostile (e.g., you can't block ads, because that would change the code).

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#125

Post by nottorp »

kbolino wrote: post #124
nottorp wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Responsability would mean no services open to the internet by default and not running arbitrary code from any random web site though. What you're describing is more like security theater. Does the TPM protect grandma from malicious javascript? :)

"Services open to the Internet" is more of a 2000s problem than a modern problem. Operating systems default to being a lot less trusting of local networks today, and nearly every place you'd connect to WiFi already has a router with a "drop all unsolicited packets" policy. MITM is the big risk here, and the best way to address it is by using secure protocols (HTTPS, SSH, etc.) everywhere. Mandatory code signing for w…

Are we philosophising?

> "Services open to the Internet" is more of a 2000s problem than a modern problem.

Then why does Windows need a firewall that's on by default, if it has no open services?

> Mandatory code signing for web sites would go a long way to addressing some of the most common types of exploits we see today

All the spam I'm filtering today has their DKIM and domain whatever and and and ... in order. I'm sure it would be the same for $random_phishing_site. They do have legit looking SSL certs don't they?

> it too could become user-hostile (e.g., you can't block ads, because that would change the code)

Or even worse, you'd need to submit your site to a review from some authority, App Store style. Pay for the signature. Pay for the review process.

Can you spell barrier to entry and speech that's restricted via financial means?

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#126

Post by jauntywundrkind »

nottorp wrote: post #18

How's Mint? I'm asking because I installed a fresh ubuntu desktop in a VM today and the spam I got on first run reminded me of ... Windows.

Mint is prehistoric.

I can't imagine recommending anyone run a distro that is effectively 10 years old & not really changing. It's still X11 and (mostly) gtk3!

It was a good option in 2015. And for some people I get that never changing never ever doing anything different is a huge value add for them. But I can't recommend starting your Linux experience by rusting in place, by using entirely backwards looking systems. Trying to ignore the broader ecosystem is a bad first Linux start.

Debian KDE is my go-to recommendation these days. Gnome is also fine but much less familiar, and most users I've found tend to like having options where-as gnome seemingly went to war with settings & customization. Debian isn't the most supportive but it's solid & amazing. Trixie is gonna be great, can't wait for release!

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#127

Post by nottorp »

yxhuvud wrote: post #75
nottorp wrote: post #18

How's Mint? I'm asking because I installed a fresh ubuntu desktop in a VM today and the spam I got on first run reminded me of ... Windows.

Huh, what spam did you get installing ubuntu?

I forgot the details already but i got a wizard style setup screen pushing extra services, then a pop up and an update screen both showed up, one wanting to upgrade me to the next LTS (i used 22.04 for reproducibility reasons) and one informing me there are package updates, in spite of the installer allegedly installing updates just 2 minutes before.

Suspiciously like Windows.

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#128

Post by nottorp »

account42 wrote: post #105
nottorp wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> much more easily bypassed without TPM and secure boot How does secure boot help against a browser vulnerability exploitation? Especially on Windows? And if we're talking local attacks, there's always the $5 wrench to bypass the TPM. > force-dragging their manufacturers and customers into 2010s era security is long overdue. Spoken like someone who gets the newest tech toy without having to think if they can afford i…

> How does secure boot help against a browser vulnerability exploitation? Especially on Windows? It will eventually do that by only allowing you to run microsoft-approved signed software. Of course no sane person should want that but it's what all this is building towards.

> only allowing you to run microsoft-approved signed software

That means it will only browse microsoft.com?

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#129

Post by dismalaf »

imzadi wrote: post #33
ryao wrote: post #22

Every time this happens, I wonder why people do not just drop Windows entirely.

Like it or not, Linux is still not really user friendly compared to a windows computer. Users still have to do command line stuff, and the software you are used to is not available. The equivalents are not as shiny as the windows versions. Macs might be too expensive for some people who are still running on old hardware.

> Users still have to do command line stuff

You absolutely don't have to. There's no reason for normal users to ever touch the command line, every essential task (installing stuff, updating) can be done through the GUI on most distros. Certainly the main ones like Ubuntu, Fedora and openSuse.

> the software you are used to is not available

This is the main issue. The average user has a meltdown if a single button moves. I still remember the Office ribbon fiasco, Windows 8 fiasco, etc...

Re: Microsoft's big lie: Your computer is fine, and you don't need to buy a new one

#130

Post by dismalaf »

TremendousJudge wrote: post #115
JohnFen wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Users still have to do command line stuff Not really, unless they're doing something special. But if they're doing something special, they're not average users.

> unless they're doing something special In my experience with Linux desktop, this could be "have the touchpad work the same as it did on Windows", "plug in an extra monitor and have it behave somewhat normally", or "play this game". But yeah, I guess that as long as we only expect "average users" to only use a web browser to look at Youtube, it's fine.

> have the touchpad work the same as it did on Windows", "plug in an extra monitor and have it behave somewhat normally", or "play this game".

I have no idea how touchpads behave on Windows, but in, say, Gnome or KDE, you can adjust it through the GUI. Extra monitors work fine on Gnome. Steam works fine in general, across distros.

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