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Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

trifectatech.org

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Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#121

Post by bArray »

> This move is part of a broader effort by Canonical to improve the resilience and maintainability of core system components. Sudo-rs is developed by the Trifecta Tech Foundation (TTF), a nonprofit organization that creates secure, open source building blocks for infrastructure software.

Ubuntu continuously updates itself without permission, killing apps and losing previous state. You have the Javascript based Gnome window manager that is always bugging out. The Ubuntu packages, drivers and kernel are laughably behind Debian and even further behind mainline. Ubuntu continues to morph into something I don't believe in.

That all said, Rust is not a smoking gun for incorrect application logic. It could still happily incorrectly execute stuff with the wrong permissions or blow something up badly. I think it's also a bad idea to offer it as a drop-in replacement when clearly features are still missing since a long time [1].

[1] https://github.com/trifectatechfoundation/sudo-rs/issues?pag...

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#122

Post by johnisgood »

__s wrote: post #116
johnisgood wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why are we not using Ada / SPARK?

Indeed Ada found popularity for aircraft software Rust is part of a modernized iteration in language design this century Nobody is calling for Ada code to be rewritten in Rust. But at this point you'd want an argument to choose Ada over Rust when it has become more widespread, especially in open source projects Here's someone else's take on your question a few years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28347930

Just for the curious, Ada is used in these industries:

- Avionics

- ATM

- Space

- Rail

- Automotive

- Defense

- Security

- Medical

https://www.adacore.com/about-ada

You can find lots of resources here to learn Ada / SPARK: https://learn.adacore.com or just to see what is up. Alternatively, there are good blog posts, too.

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#123

Post by johnisgood »

__s wrote: post #116
johnisgood wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why are we not using Ada / SPARK?

Indeed Ada found popularity for aircraft software Rust is part of a modernized iteration in language design this century Nobody is calling for Ada code to be rewritten in Rust. But at this point you'd want an argument to choose Ada over Rust when it has become more widespread, especially in open source projects Here's someone else's take on your question a few years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28347930

I thought I should reply separately to your comment, but I do not see how he got to the conclusion "in other words, if your goal is to write a (say) safe implementation of the DOM that can render real-world web pages while efficiently using memory on a general-purpose computer, Ada is probably the wrong tool for the job.". My only "issue" here would be its verbosity, which is why I choose C still quite often.

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#124

Post by wkat4242 »

bArray wrote: post #121

> This move is part of a broader effort by Canonical to improve the resilience and maintainability of core system components. Sudo-rs is developed by the Trifecta Tech Foundation (TTF), a nonprofit organization that creates secure, open source building blocks for infrastructure software. Ubuntu continuously updates itself without permission, killing apps and losing previous state. You have the Javascript based Gnome…

I think you mean a magic bullet instead of a smoking gun :)

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#125

Post by __s »

johnisgood wrote: post #123
__s wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed Ada found popularity for aircraft software Rust is part of a modernized iteration in language design this century Nobody is calling for Ada code to be rewritten in Rust. But at this point you'd want an argument to choose Ada over Rust when it has become more widespread, especially in open source projects Here's someone else's take on your question a few years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28347930

I thought I should reply separately to your comment, but I do not see how he got to the conclusion "in other words, if your goal is to write a (say) safe implementation of the DOM that can render real-world web pages while efficiently using memory on a general-purpose computer, Ada is probably the wrong tool for the job.". My only "issue" here would be its verbosity, which is why I choose C still quite often.

They were opining that Ada is unsuitable for fine grained data structures (like Rust being awkward with linked lists) & lacking mature graphics APIs

For years I used a C window manager I wrote which was less than 150 lines[1], it can definitely be a terse language. But I've also written pretty tight Rust code for a card game engine & its http server. I don't think Rust is particularly more verbose. Rust code can be artistic too[2]

1. https://github.com/serprex/nobox/blob/master/nobox.c

2. https://github.com/serprex/Kelxquoia/blob/master/src/main.rs

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#126

Post by arp242 »

dismalaf wrote: post #32
homefree wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Not like GNU is any less religious... I think they just want to ditch GNU tools and lots of young, low level programmers want to use Rust (same rationale for Linus accepting Rust code into the kernel).

sudo isn't GNU though.

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#129

Post by johnisgood »

__s wrote: post #125
johnisgood wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought I should reply separately to your comment, but I do not see how he got to the conclusion "in other words, if your goal is to write a (say) safe implementation of the DOM that can render real-world web pages while efficiently using memory on a general-purpose computer, Ada is probably the wrong tool for the job.". My only "issue" here would be its verbosity, which is why I choose C still quite often.

They were opining that Ada is unsuitable for fine grained data structures (like Rust being awkward with linked lists) & lacking mature graphics APIs For years I used a C window manager I wrote which was less than 150 lines[1], it can definitely be a terse language. But I've also written pretty tight Rust code for a card game engine & its http server. I don't think Rust is particularly more verbose. Rust code can be a…

To be honest, I have not yet written Rust seriously, so I cannot comment as much on it. I mostly use C, OCaml, Lua, at times Perl, these days. I do not know how much the language would feel like it is getting in the way of "expressing" my thoughts.

https://github.com/serprex/nobox/blob/master/nobox.c is definitely terse. :D I get lost just by looking at it; a little bit of refactoring (indentation-wise) would help though.

Re: Memory-safe sudo to become the default in Ubuntu

#130

Post by steveklabnik »

postepowanieadm wrote: post #127
paulddraper wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A trivial Google search answers that. run0 requires systemd-type OS.

No one is rewriting systemd in rust?

I'm not aware of any serious project to do so, there's been some small projects, nothing on the scale of uutils or sudo-rs.
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