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Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#121

Post by cjbgkagh »

tgma wrote: post #111
cjbgkagh wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keeping secrets from the public is a good way to lose the public trust which they’ll need to stay in power. Otherwise their replacements will have their own secret reasons to be deporting people. I’ve already resigned myself to the reality that freedom of speech no longer exists and hasn’t existed for some time. I think only the times when we thought we had freedom of speech was when information was very tightly cont…

I believe they stated that for at least a few of the cases: dude came to the US to dismantle western civilization and acted upon it. Good riddance. They are free to exercise their Freedom of Speech and Due Process under Sharia Law in their home country (or the UK).

If the right loses the culture war then those deported will just be invited back to finish the job.

Either do a ‘dewokification’ on the scale of Germanys ‘denazification’ or do not. This half measure is sure to fail, exercising power may be cathartic but it comes at the cost of legitimacy which in the long run will come at the cost of power. The Trump administration should focus on governing well not on capriciously punishing weak individuals in raids. The right wing is split on the issue of Israel and the pending war with Iran is already unpopular and it hasn’t even started yet.

Sometimes I wonder if the only thing that could save the right would be if AOC gets the democratic nomination - I wouldn’t put it past them.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#122

Post by kragen »

FireBeyond wrote: post #102
nxhxgs wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not like immigrants have had wonderful, controllable and predictable paths to residency in the past. For those who arent Einstein or belong to the over rated HN crowd, the system has always be exploitative. Anyone who isnt born rich and has been through the process has had to live with constant fear, doubt and uncertainty.

I emigrated to the US as a fiancée. It was not necessarily easy or cheap (I'm agreeing with you) and I came from a "low visa fraud risk country" (Australia). Some of the challenges faced: It probably cost around $30,000 all up. Every visit to a consular office or USCIS cost about $100 in biometrics alone (each time). Fees for applying, fees for adjustments. My partner and I had an issue where I was supporting her (sh…

As lesbians, do you think it would be more difficult for you under Trump? Was this before or after Australia legalized same-sex marriage seven years ago?

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#123

Post by zepton »

sashank_1509 wrote: post #80
parineum wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there some rule that says other people aren't allowed to pursue a green card? That doesn't seem like a differentiator to me. That's a real question, I have no idea how any of it really works in the practical sense.

Yes, there are visas Like L1 Visa where you can work in US but never apply for a Green Card, and this is considered a non immigrant visa while H1b is considered a dual intent visa. Which is why regularly people who come in on L1, separately participate in the H1b lottery!

L-1 is dual intent.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#124

Post by em-bee »

mlinhares wrote: post #113
em-bee wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think this is a key point, and this is why this problem will remain until we make some drastic changes. to look at a completely different example: the internet was designed on good faith. year after year more things have been put into place to protect against those not operating in good faith. proof of work against AI bots is just the latest example. what is really needed is a change in education. we need to teach…

not to be harsh but let me tell you, this is bullshit, there's only rule of law if most people accept it. its all ink in paper, the moment someone tries to subvert or pretend it doesn't exist and there are no consequences the "law" is irrelevant. the laws only exist to the extent that the people that "control" it are willing to exert it. for instance, at any other point in time, everyone involved in the signal-gate s…

but this is the problem. we lost good faith. but we can't continue down this road. it will end in a bureaucratic nightmare.

laws can only cover the excesses. if you make laws to detailed then the enforcement of those laws will become to expensive and that will make them even less likely to be enforced. one example are social benefits. it has been argued (i don't know in which country) that being less strict in who gets benefits would save more money than the loss caused by those who should not receive them.

NIMBYism is also an outgrowth of that. another example, in germany large scale projects are taking decades and cost 10 times as much as planned because people are not acting in good faith. the US is not far behind in some areas. (the high speed rail project in california comes to mind)

yes, you can't rely on people acting in good faith. but there was a time when you could. and we need to get back to that.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#125

Post by tgma »

FireBeyond wrote: post #107
jasonjayr wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure it's discretionary. But to (a) Revoke it with no warning (b) Instantly making your presense illegal, and you a criminal, and due to your new criminal status(c) immediatly abducting you by masked, unidentified "officers" in an official capacity and sending you on a plane anywhere but here, seems to, I don't know? "stir the pot" as you say? These revocations could be done far more graciously than they are. It cert…

Exactly. It's discretionary, but for reasons I won't go into here, I had to have an immigration attorney for my green card adjustment. Her constant refrain was that I was not to worry as it was "discretionary but presumptive" - my previous efforts and process laid it that the onus was on the USG to show that my green card was or might be fraudulent or in bad faith. Now? The same applies, but the current administratio…

My friend was married to a USC (bona fide legit marriage) and they almost fucked them over during Biden administration casting doubt on their marriage. In San Francisco, not some red state. Many examples of that nature regardless of the administration.

Almost always if your case is legit, you'll be fine in the end and nothing to worry about, just as your lawyer says, but it does not mean there won't be a bumpy ride. I genuinely doubt Trump administration is any worse or better unless you affirmatively have anti-Western ideas or from Travel Ban countries. In fact, the anecdotes I have heard so far on the consular processing of Immigrant Visas is better than Biden era.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#126

Post by kragen »

tgma wrote: post #53
jasonjayr wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure it's discretionary. But to (a) Revoke it with no warning (b) Instantly making your presense illegal, and you a criminal, and due to your new criminal status(c) immediatly abducting you by masked, unidentified "officers" in an official capacity and sending you on a plane anywhere but here, seems to, I don't know? "stir the pot" as you say? These revocations could be done far more graciously than they are. It cert…

I mean, I was discussing the law, now we pivot to emotions? The "masked" guys immediately showed their badges if we are talking about the same incident. When you come to the US on a visa, you should not be under any illusions that is not the case. In fact, a US visa is not even guarantee of entry to the US as you are reminded when you get one. I am not aware if any other country behaves differently if they want a for…

Here in Argentina, legal immigrants' visas cannot be revoked, and illegal immigrants generally can only be deported if they are accused of a crime. (Being present illegally is not itself a crime.) They have several weeks to challenge the deportation in court.

Nearly all other countries behave differently. The kind of "immigration law enforcement" we're seeing today in the US is far outside the norms of liberal democracy.

Debating morality rather than legality, any policy that gives thugs free rein to grab people who are not harming others off the street, and imprison them, is immoral, and should be stopped. Even if it were the policy of every country in the world, it should still be stopped.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#127

Post by TylerE »

lurk2 wrote: post #120
foogazi wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What has changed? From the freaking title: “Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.”

Can you point to any specific policy changes or case studies?

That the administration thinks they just just drag people into vans and ship them off to a foreign prison?

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#128

Post by kragen »

tgma wrote: post #77
cameldrv wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would normally at least be entitled to due process. My understanding is that Trump is citing a law that allows the President to deport nationals of a country we are at war with without due process, except we aren’t at war with Turkey.

I believe you are mixing up different cases. That is not the statute used at all for the Turkey case. The Alien Enemies Act you are referring to was exclusively used for the designated foreign terrorist organizations (i.e. TdA & MS13; Venezuelans who went to El Salvador prison).

You also aren't at war with TdA or MS-13.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#129

Post by kragen »

OccamsMirror wrote: post #93
addicted wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s fine. All those H1Bs will go back to their home countries, work for the same companies at a fraction of the salary and instead of paying taxes and rent and other expenses in the US will pay in their home countries. And when they are laid off, or drop off to start their own companies, those companies will be based in their home countries instead of in the U.S. I think this is a great and moral plan to reverse t…

As an Australian I'm pretty keen to start seeing a higher tier of people choosing Australia over the US to move to now.

Australia is not famous for openness to immigration; people overseas are more likely to know about Pauline Hanson and the prison camps in Nauru.

Re: Tech companies are telling immigrant employees on visas not to leave the U.S.

#130

Post by em-bee »

BrenBarn wrote: post #117
em-bee wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think this is a key point, and this is why this problem will remain until we make some drastic changes. to look at a completely different example: the internet was designed on good faith. year after year more things have been put into place to protect against those not operating in good faith. proof of work against AI bots is just the latest example. what is really needed is a change in education. we need to teach…

I tend to think that, unfortunately, it's the other way around. What we need to teach the next generation is that good faith, while still to be treasured, cannot be relied on, and we must be prepared to unflinchingly root out bad actors and forcibly prevent them from making things worse for people.

rooting out bad actors is most effectively done by proper education to keep them from becoming bad actors in the first place. any other approach in rooting out bad actors risks judgement errors and should only be applied in the most egregious of cases. and even there the approach should be: "look, you may mean well, but your actions hurt to many people, and therefore we must reject your approach and tell you to stop"
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