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Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

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Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#121
post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That’s an unpopular opinion but given more than a decade of remote work experience I’d say: yes, people are less efficient in remote environment (on average). Thankfully that's just an opinion, and the stats bear out the opposite. Regretfully, managers and workers who want to RTO will force us to do so regardless.

In this day and age, you can find stats to support any possible claim you can imagine ;)

> In this day and age, you can find stats to support any possible claim you can imagine ;)

Can you support that claim with stats?

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#122

I remember working for a small agency in London with a bit of a top-heavy management structure. Many times would my shoulder be subtly gazed over to "check on progress". I ended up using IRSSI to chat with friends, wgets to read my fav blogs, and my twitter stream pouring into what looked like an excel spreadsheet UI . I always got my work done in the first couple hours of the day. I will always resent those managers…

> a manager who could remote-log-in to my machine at random times to spot-monitor my work

Is that a British thing? I've only ever heard that from people working in the UK, but there it doesn't seem to be uncommon.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#123

I remember working for a small agency in London with a bit of a top-heavy management structure. Many times would my shoulder be subtly gazed over to "check on progress". I ended up using IRSSI to chat with friends, wgets to read my fav blogs, and my twitter stream pouring into what looked like an excel spreadsheet UI . I always got my work done in the first couple hours of the day. I will always resent those managers…

I can't help but think that there must be some arbitrage opportunity there: massive companies hire top notch engineers and all make them waste their time in (commute to/from) offices. What if someone comes along and is like "I'm going to provide the exact same service, but without offices and everybody works from home". That company would have a competitive edge, because: people from the established company would hav…

> Does the fact that WFH is not a thing mean that in the real world, for most people, coming to the office IS actually more efficient?

WFH is still a thing despite some big names pulling back on it.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#124
post #59

I remember working for a small agency in London with a bit of a top-heavy management structure. Many times would my shoulder be subtly gazed over to "check on progress". I ended up using IRSSI to chat with friends, wgets to read my fav blogs, and my twitter stream pouring into what looked like an excel spreadsheet UI . I always got my work done in the first couple hours of the day. I will always resent those managers…

They just don't get that some people can't spread their time into perfectly equal slices of productivity. Remote work and flexible time has allowed me to work a big productive burst in the morning and in the late evening, spaced way more than 8 hours apart, with busywork somewhere in the middle. Probably wouldn't work this well if I had to do that in an office, in a single 8 hour (or 4+1+4) segment.

This is my issue. For whatever reason, i used to get most of my work done between 4PM and 10PM. Unfortunately, I had to be at my desk at 9AM.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#125
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't help but think that there must be some arbitrage opportunity there: massive companies hire top notch engineers and all make them waste their time in (commute to/from) offices. What if someone comes along and is like "I'm going to provide the exact same service, but without offices and everybody works from home". That company would have a competitive edge, because: people from the established company would hav…

That’s an unpopular opinion but given more than a decade of remote work experience I’d say: yes, people are less efficient in remote environment (on average). The „on average” is key however. I’d say that most of the people don’t understand the cost of remote work until it hits them and simply not all can bear that cost. It’s not like people are unwilling (occasionally you can find slackers) but it’s more often thing…

> yes, people are less efficient in remote environment (on average).

Maybe, depending on the tasks. Also it depends on whether or not you take the view of the employee or employer. Say you work 8 hours a day (which even people in offices don't do) as the employer I do agree that you might get more done if people are in the office, but as the employee, I'll add my commute as well, so I now work 9 - 10 hours per day, part of which is completely unproductive. You also need to factor in that there is a shit ton of people who are fairly unproductive even at the office, they just look busy.

There are some fields where I can easily see the office being more productive in general, but you also have tasks where you move people for no reason. I think accounting is a pretty good example of a job that almost never require you to be at the office. Many companies even outsource this to other companies that most definitely isn't at the same office.

If you instead hired people to do a job, not be in front of a computer for 8 hours, then you could probably have an even higher level of efficiency. Imagine working from home, have a stack of assigned tasks for the day and be informed that once those are done you free to spend whatever remain of your eight hours as you please. I assure you that people will get shit done at light speed.

It's about management, and management mostly have not, and have no desire to evolve to handle work-from-home. You need better managers, more highly trained managers and managers that works harder than they do in the office, which many of them don't want to.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#126
post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look interesting, but seems like it's Linux only. And closed source.

https://github.com/dustinkirkland/hollywood

Ahh sorry. My mistake. I thought those were Linux executables (ELF). Turns out those are Bash scripts.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this day and age, you can find stats to support any possible claim you can imagine ;)

> In this day and age, you can find stats to support any possible claim you can imagine ;) Can you support that claim with stats?

Not OP, but: of course! If you can't find existing stats, just create new ones to support your claim.

See also: https://www.wired.com/2009/09/fmrisalmon/

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#128
post #109
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does the fact that WFH is not a thing mean that in the real world, for most people, coming to the office IS actually more efficient? Or does this just need more time? I'm honestly not sure, but I've sure been tempted to start a competitor to very silly old fashion "you shall come here and sit at a computer where I can see you" type companies. Sadly yes. I was grumbling about finding a solution to a problem and a co…

Ok but don't you have engineering wide slack/teams channels where these discussions can happen? If I think to my self 'man this is really hard to achieve for whatever company specific reason' I don't just stew on it for days by myself.

If you always post complaints to these channels, and nobody else supports you - you look like a complainer. If you first find some people with the same problem at the water cooler and you say "we have this problem as a group" then you are proactive.

Re: Generate impressive-looking terminal output, look busy when stakeholders walk by

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then there’s self-drive requirement that can easily be extinguished It is 99% extinguished by low pay though. Low pay means person can't afford better living environment, can't afford leaving toxic partner, can't afford to go out or hobbies which leads to depression. > Efficient teams are more difficult to create when there is no space for people to bond over non-work (team pizza/social events) That has nothing to…

Burn out is hard to manage; its something that happens in the cruisy 20-something hour a week job as well as the 80+ hour pressure cooker. Probably not to the same degree sure, but its not the only thing going on here. Its a whole lot more sustainable if you can build an identity around "here is my team, we are building {___}", and its a lot easier to get there if you meet in person frequently. Genuinely clear object…

> Burn out is hard to manage; its something that happens in the cruisy 20-something hour a week job

Usually burn out is also caused by bad management. For instance, noisy open plan office where developers are mixed with sales and other departments to "cross pollinate" and have "creative juices flowing". Most people can't really focus on work and then are blamed for poor performance. If you have bills to pay, you often actually work after work, when you go home, to meet deadlines. Other instance I saw - "busy" meetings throughout the week, repetitive stuff, so certain people can be seen as they are "managing", also peppered throughout the day so you don't get more than an hour of uninterrupted work. Then again blame "why this and that is not delivered?".

> and its a lot easier to get there if you meet in person frequently.

I accept that some people struggle to adapt to online asynchronous communication, but in person meetings are inefficient from creative point of view. They disrupt flow and don't give opportunity for everyone to be heard. Some people can give answers or ideas instantly (not necessarily a good ones) others need information to simmer in their heads for a while. You of course get a sense of achieving something, but this won't be optimal. Basically just cheap dopamine.

> its harder to answer "why are we doing this?"

Answer is actually simple. To pay the bills, have roof over one's head, to have kids in good school, to enjoy life outside of work. If you are employee or contractor, you are not building your own thing. It's good to always remember that and keep a healthy distance.

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