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LineageOS 22

lineageos.org

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Re: LineageOS 22

#121
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't have it, because this is like security. You either have it everywhere, or it doesn't matter. Sure, the Linux kernel is very capable, but the "gnu" userspace doesn't make good use of its features. Android makes much better use and has a bunch of software that could be re-used on the former as well.

Is the reason GNU doesn't use these kernel features aggressively that they want to be portable? Or something else?

Freezing background apps just isn't needed all that much if you run a fully FLOSS system. It's much more of a concern for proprietary software where you don't have the source code available. There's a similar story for sandboxing actually, it's not a coincidence that it's been getting more popular as proprietary apps have been made widely available via Flathub and the like.

Re: LineageOS 22

#122

I still buy devices based on the likelihood that they will be supported by LineageOS. Good to see them continuing along.

Can anyone recommend a supported phone that is small in size?

Re: LineageOS 22

#123
post #83
post #73

How's LineageOS with WhatsApp, Signal and random banking apps these days? Or let me put it another way: anyone running LineageOS but struggled to run any essential apps? (I don't care about games or whatever, I mean the apps you need to get around in life).

Whatsapp and Signal are fine. Random banking apps suck because their myopic and incompetent policies around custom OSes. Especially here in Germany where banks and even tech company management see internet as a magic, totally untrustworthy new curiosity. Combined with the overall extreme risk-averse society, basically none of the bank apps from big banks work with custom OSes. All require various levels of "hacking".…

The Wells Fargo app runs on Lineage. Google Pay does not work with it.

My original motivation for deploying this particular phone was for Cisco Duo, which also runs on it.

Re: LineageOS 22

#124

Can you get this to install on Fire tablets? They are getting cheaper and cheaper, but the utility value without a minimal stock environment is very less.

Unfortunately most of the older models do not have a way to root them (AFAICT, I've checked in on this occasionally for years). I have a 2017 fire that I was able to get lineage on, but unfortunately it was a mostly broken "test" device. Another 2017 is slightly different and I fried trying to short to ground during the rooting process. I also have 2 slightly newer models that have no root available at all, and are virtually unusable as the stock OS has become so slow (5+ second lag times per tap).

Re: LineageOS 22

#125

Love to see the ongoing progress here, but I'm really starting to worry that the growth of attestation on Android will make using custom ROMs like LineageOS impossible in future. Is there any way we can fight this? Feels like there must be some EU/US consumer rights or digital market legislation somewhere that could be used to more directly object to organizations like banks saying "your phone works just fine but we…

What is stopping LineageOS from supporting (or faking support for) attestation?

Re: LineageOS 22

#126
post #125

Love to see the ongoing progress here, but I'm really starting to worry that the growth of attestation on Android will make using custom ROMs like LineageOS impossible in future. Is there any way we can fight this? Feels like there must be some EU/US consumer rights or digital market legislation somewhere that could be used to more directly object to organizations like banks saying "your phone works just fine but we…

What is stopping LineageOS from supporting (or faking support for) attestation?

This is an extreme oversimplification in an "Explain like I'm 5" style (terminology might also not be perfectly correct, it's more for illustration of the basic concepts):

Imagine, if inside your phone, there's your main processor named Bob. Bob runs all of your apps, Bob is occasionally stupid and gets hacked, but he means well.

Also inside your phone, is another processor named Alice. Bob can't see her even if he can send messages to her, but Alice can see Bob through a one-way mirror. Alice is also located inside of a concrete steel bunker with no entry, no exit, and UV sterilization of all single-page letters coming in or out after examination by an officer. Alice has a special ID card given to her by Google, which was only given her after Google was satisfied in the security of the bunker.

Google sends super high-secure work for Bob to do. Bob isn't the most trustworthy of fellows; so Google also sends a message asking Alice to report back on whether Bob is doing what he's supposed to. Alice sends her report back to Google with her signature on it. Google trusts that signature, because it previously inspected Alice and the security of her bunker, and knows that as long as Alice is safe and Bob can't harm her, Bob is doing the work intended.

Now, you might say, why not just make sure Bob is stronger? Well, Google tried that, but with people wanting to sideload apps, the needs of developers, security bugs, that's all extremely difficult. Having Alice do nothing but verify and sign in a super secure bunker while accepting various requests for oversight - that's easy, auditable, much easier to secure, and rarely needs change.

Where it gets even stronger is what I would call, for lack of a better word, "progressive lockdown." For example, when Bob is just starting up, Alice can check that he started up from an approved OS (Secure Boot). Once that's happened, the Secure OS might hand Alice a piece of code for the OS that is never allowed to change in the future while the device is booted (Secure Monitor / TEE). Alice doesn't have to run the code herself; just panic if that code ever changes. By doing so, the OS now has super-high-security functions for itself, that can always be changed out through any update, without Alice needing any updates, changes, or expanded attack surface herself. By that point, Alice can be OS-agnostic so it doesn't matter whether it's Bob or Kevin, and could even be a permanent hardware feature that never needs updates... oops, you've just invented TPM / Verified Boot / Titan M.

Re: LineageOS 22

#127
post #73

How's LineageOS with WhatsApp, Signal and random banking apps these days? Or let me put it another way: anyone running LineageOS but struggled to run any essential apps? (I don't care about games or whatever, I mean the apps you need to get around in life).

If you install Gapps, most banking apps work fine. Only Revolution refused to start on account of having an unlocked bootloader.

Re: LineageOS 22

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the reason GNU doesn't use these kernel features aggressively that they want to be portable? Or something else?

Freezing background apps just isn't needed all that much if you run a fully FLOSS system. It's much more of a concern for proprietary software where you don't have the source code available. There's a similar story for sandboxing actually, it's not a coincidence that it's been getting more popular as proprietary apps have been made widely available via Flathub and the like.

What, FLOSS systems run on unicorn blood or what?

There is a reason why Pinephone and similar run hot as hell for a couple of hours of uptime only. But Linux laptops also have a terrible track record here. It has nothing to do with privacy, it's purely there to properly save energy.

And come on, Linux Desktop has terrible security, just because no one targets the 3% marketshare doesn't mean that they are safe at all. Especially that security is independent of "proprietariness". You can have, say, an open source PDF reader with a vulnerability - you only need to open a malicious PDF file to have your system corrupted. Putting our heads into the sand is not a good idea.

Re: LineageOS 22

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android is not "a Linux phone", it just happens to use Linux kernel under the hood. What you're saying was always an explicit anti-goal.

This is gatekeeping. Linux is a kernel. You're talking about userspace which is not part of the Linux kernel project.

What gatekeeping? I'm talking about Android project goals. They never intended to provide any direct userspace access to the Linux kernel. The Linux kernel is supposed to be an implementation detail that can be replaced without breaking app compatibility.

Re: LineageOS 22

#130

Highly recommend the Samsung S5e Tablet with LineageOS. It’s an amazing tablet for comics and light reading. Hard to beat its high res AMOLED display, incredibly light weight, and decent enough specs (I haven’t personally seen slowdowns when using Lineage on a minimal install). Forgoing gapps gets you crazy standby time. Couple things to note is it doesn’t have a headphone jack (it is legitimately that thin though) a…

> required to use Windows There’s an alternative flasher for Samsung’s bootloader that works on Linux/macOS: https://github.com/Benjamin-Dobell/Heimdall It might not work with this particular tablet, though.

Yeah, I never got Heimdall to work properly.
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