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From where I left

antirez.com

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Re: From where I left

#121

Post by PeterZaitsev »

Hehehe,

Reading between the lines. Redis is Hurting, Valkey is making a real difference at pulling the customers away. Elastic and OpenSearch were in similar situation, so Elastic went on to change license back to (more restrictive) Open Source License.

Redis went different route by bringing Redis founder back. I wonder if they go back on their license change next or do they think Redis founder endorsing license change, despite his previous promises of Redis being Open Source forever is enough ? Time will tell.

Re: From where I left

#122

Post by bitexploder »

simonw wrote: post #104
sroussey wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah thanks. Is this by AWS or similar?

Yes: https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press/linux-foundation-launc... > Industry participants, including Amazon Web Services (AWS), Google Cloud, Oracle, Ericsson, and Snap Inc. are supporting Valkey.

Cloud providers offer productized versions of Redis, so their interest in Valkey should be obvious :)

Re: From where I left

#123

Post by stochastician »

> At some point my daughter, who is now 12, and is a crucial person in my life, enlightening my days with her intelligence, creativity and love, wanted to visit NYC for her birthday.

I know this wasn't the point of the post, but it was the most beautiful thing I've read all week, and really sums up how I feel about my own children. A small aside in a much longer post but incredibly humanizing and wonderful.

Re: From where I left

#124

Post by antirez »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #54
echelon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> why not join Valkey? Valkey is making it possible for hyperscalers to continue appropriating open source and charging fat margins to everyone else. In a sense, Valkey is the bad guy here. And just look at all the support Valkey is getting from Amazon, Google, Oracle, etc. They're perpetuating the problem. The same thing happened with Elasticsearch. Unfortunately ICs without decision-making power started lambasting…

Many of the Redis developers left to form Valkey, so that they could keep working on the Open Source project they wanted to work on. Valkey is continuing a project that was released under Open Source terms, after the original company rugpulled the Open Source project in favor of a proprietary one. Or, in other words, Valkey is Jenkins here, and Redis is Hudson.

> Many of the Redis developers left to form Valkey

What's the point of spreading informations that are not true? I believe there is a single person that was in Redis and works there now, at least AFAIK. And this person stopped working at Redis long time ago (and was not a core developer). So I'm not understanding who joined ValKey from Redis folks.

Everybody is working at Redis: me, Oran, Yossi, Meir, many others.

Re: From where I left

#125

Post by TacticalCoder »

Veen wrote: post #26
dxuh wrote: post #23

> hint: (Claude AI is in its own league) Is there a good way to use the Anthropic models as a private person? It's my understanding you can only pay for them as a business.

You can use the API and Claude as a private individual. I've been doing so for a couple of years. Edit: Go here and create an account: console.anthropic.com

> You can use the API and Claude as a private individual. I've been doing so for a couple of years.

You're using Claude since a "couple of years". You really must be an early adopter ; )

Re: From where I left

#126

Post by jrochkind1 »

fishtoaster wrote: post #80

I'm really interested in this bit: "the fracture with the community is not about licensing, or at least it’s not mainly about licensing" I wish he'd elaborated a bit more on what he thought it was about. My understanding is that it's 100% about the license. That's certainly why I'll reach for valkey instead of redis next time I need it. That's also what I've heard from everyone else in a similar position. What else w…

Yeah, I have the same question, I wasn't sure if he had said what he does think the fracture was mainly about and I missed it.

Re: From where I left

#127

Post by bsnnkv »

simonw wrote: post #68

For me, the license change upset me mainly for two reasons: 1. Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free - both in terms of code but also in advocacy, writing tutorials, publishing example code etc - and when they did that it was under the understanding that project would remain under the same open source license. It honestly felt like a betrayal of trust. 2. From a purely selfish point…

> I do also see these kinds of license trends as harmful to open source generally

I've re-read this a few times and I'm still not sure what "harmful to open source" means in this sentence, could you expand on this a bit when you have time? (readings I considered: this will dissuade people from using OSI licenses, this will dissuade people from trying to monetize open source components, this will dissuade people from using open source components in their products all together, this will dissuade people from contributing to open source)

> Many people had contributed their efforts to the Redis project for free

This one is not directly addressed at OP but I would be interested to see what the contribution numbers are like for Redis and other projects post-license change.

In my own limited experience (project with >10k, Editing this post to say thanks for the response and clarity, I don't have anything else to add!

Re: From where I left

#128

Post by bhouston »

antirez wrote: post #124
JoshTriplett wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of the Redis developers left to form Valkey, so that they could keep working on the Open Source project they wanted to work on. Valkey is continuing a project that was released under Open Source terms, after the original company rugpulled the Open Source project in favor of a proprietary one. Or, in other words, Valkey is Jenkins here, and Redis is Hudson.

> Many of the Redis developers left to form Valkey What's the point of spreading informations that are not true? I believe there is a single person that was in Redis and works there now, at least AFAIK. And this person stopped working at Redis long time ago (and was not a core developer). So I'm not understanding who joined ValKey from Redis folks. Everybody is working at Redis: me, Oran, Yossi, Meir, many others.

> I believe there is a single person that was in Redis and works there now, at least AFAIK. And this person stopped working at Redis long time ago (and was not a core developer).

It is probably more correct to say a bunch of Redis contributors left the Redis GitHub project and moved over to Valkey.

You can see there are a bunch of contributors listed on this page who seem to predate the fork and who have continued to contribute:

https://github.com/valkey-io/valkey/graphs/contributors

Particularly these contributors standout:

https://github.com/enjoy-binbin

https://github.com/madolson

https://github.com/soloestoy

https://github.com/hwware

https://github.com/zuiderkwast

https://github.com/hpatro

https://github.com/pizhenwei

Re: From where I left

#129

Post by mattbillenstein »

Well written and thoughtful piece - I don't have problems with the license - they control the project, they can do what they want, I can use it or not as I want.

The thing that's interesting to me is the idea that these things have to continue to "evolve." Like we need to keep adding features to keep people engaged to have an active community, yada yada.

In my mind, and maybe I'm wrong, some of these projects are just sorta finished - they've evolved to a completed state more or less and just need maintenance. Memcached has sorta went this route afaict - it's still tremendously useful for some things and it's not constantly trying to add data types to compete with other things.

Re: From where I left

#130

Post by BeefySwain »

All the conversations about SSPL seem to go the same way:

- Someone complains about the extra restrictions imposed on AWS (lets be real, it's basically just about AWS)

- People point out that SSPL is basically AGPL+, and that for the vast vast majority of people it doesn't make any difference

- People counter that the SSPL is written ambiguously/untested in court, and so while it might seem like it's AGPL+ and doesn't matter for most users, you can't rely on that

- People complain about rug pulling (valid, IMO)

My question is this: Can there be a AGPL+ that is OSI approved? Could there be a "AAGPL" that GNU releases that covers this (very common, and IMO valid) "need" for open source companies to not be cannibalized by cloud providers?

Is this conceptually unacceptable, or is it just that the SSPL is poorly executed?

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