Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yugoslavia?
That was not a NATO action.
Yes, it was [1].
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_bombing_of_Yugoslavia
Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
121–130 of 1001 posts
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
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Nato is a defensive alliance against any offensive act. Russia, ...as in: the mafia of the few profiteering rulers currently at the helm, is not fighting back anything. Firstly, its mad Ukrainian adventure has meant it has made its border very defence-free on its border with Nato countries. Secondly, it is constantly attacking in hybrid warfare mode, paying local lowlife to do propaganda graffiti and sabotage. The ap…
> Nato is a defensive alliance against any offensive act.
See my response to sibling comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42177029
Which NATO member was NATO defending when it bombed Libya into oblivion?
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
I agree. Do you want to sign up and go fight in a war? Or should other people besides you die? It's easy to say it "needs to be dealt with" but it's not an easy thing to do.
Some of us live close enough that it's not really an option, surrendering to Russians don't work that great if you live in Eastern Europe. I will volunteer first day to join Polish Army.
Ditto. Even though I'm an expat right now if Poland calls to arms I'm coming home and fighting to defend my country.
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#124> "it’s obvious this wasn’t an accidental anchor drop.” If it's "he who shall not be named", gotta admit, that's a clever strategy: ramp up sabotage and see how NATO/EU will feel about their "red lines", and how well does that article 5 really work in practice. Is it worth more than the paper it's printed on? Let's find out! People have been laughing at the West crossing multiple Russian "red lines" and the Russians…
Weak? Macron is rallying for major support. Poland is building an extremely strong army, and is having none of Russia's BS. Rutte is head of NATO now, and he has peace as his nr. 1 goal. There are so many ads for cybersecurity and military on tv here in the Netherlands. Ukraine received ATACMS (long range missiles) a while ago. This is why they are able to invade Russia back. We are "weak" because Putin has been dest…
Warmongering 101. Ready to protect the EU and drunken wasteland at the same time. The enemy is simultaneously pathetic and an existential threat.
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#125The constant Russian interference, combined with the regular escalation from the jets patrolling, and the radar jamming, really needs to be dealt with. We're stuck between having to do timid actions and full NATO escalation. This feels like constant creep.
> We're stuck between having to do timid actions and full NATO escalation If only there were someone applying pressure to Russia we could have fight for us!
So sacrifice more Ukrainian men for the meat grinder? What has that accomplished so far?
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
The bear metaphore is indeed nonsense. Russia is not a bear, you are dealing with a bunch of state level criminals. The state of Russia is essentially better understood as a criminal gang masquerading as a country. Those stealing, money laundering, killing, trafficking an warring circles of oligarchs are heavily rooted in Intelligence Services, inside and abroad. Some of those oligarchs even have private militaries.…
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> problem starts if (when?) Trump and his clown posse turns the US into a similar setup
Lots of institutional checks in America that post-Soviet Russia lacked.
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#127It's just practice. Locate the cables, establish a means of damaging them, deploy the means as a test and a show of force. The western economy is almost completely built using off-prem in Cloud PaaS environments. It should be pretty fun when WW3 starts and not a single hospital, school, laboratory, or factory can operate.
while outages definitely cause big problems in hospitals and schools, neither are completely dependent on connectivity in the short term. most hospitals are required to be able to operate critical services in an outage. even a full power outage. Schools will definitely be fine. they just may have a serious backlog of entering grades, absences, and payroll once things get back online.
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
"We" already screwed their pipeline, what's left? Provide Ukraine with the means to blow up the Kerch bridge maybe? They're the ones that could legitimately do that sort of escalation.
> what's left? The other pipelines. Their shadow oil fleet. There are lots of options. But to my knowledge, only the British, French and Americans are capable of the long-range clandestine operations.
Their shadow oil fleet is operated by third parties and shell companies. We are dealing with a mafia state here.
https://windward.ai/knowledge-base/illuminating-russias-shad...
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have read reams of rhetoric regarding relations with Russia rehashed as "don't poke the bear". No one ever seems to want to discuss what to do about the bear going around poking everyone else.
Those discussions are had all the time. One of downside of this bear is bear strapped with explosives that could kill us all if bear gets angry enough. Also, once you are 12 miles offshore, technically you are in international waters and thus cannot be stopped by any Navy except your own unless there is UN Sanctions. If NATO Countries decided to violate that, it obviously opens up massive can of worms that could impa…
You are evidently unaware of UNCLOS and the adoption of many of its provisions into customary international law
Re: Two undersea cables in Baltic Sea disrupted
#130Looks like a pretty transparent hint on how response to the recent US/UK/France permission to use long-range missiles against the Russian territory could look like. The Nord Stream sabotage has opened Pandora's box almost exactly how it was predicted in Cryptonomicon.