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US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

theguardian.com

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Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#121

Post by gregjor »

faangguyindia wrote: post #84
arjie wrote: post #36

One thing that's surprised me about the US is the general slowness of most things. In India, you can get MRIs and CT Scans same day. Or you could the last time I was there. And it didn't cost very much in comparison. My doctors have all been good (attested to by my parents who are surgeons themselves) but the healthcare system is wonky. One thing I didn't expect is that the Indian system where you just drag your heal…

MRI and CT scans done in India vs US will have vastly different quality. Basically, for equal quality in india you'll always end up paying 2x-5x of what you'll pay in any developed nation. This is the primary reason, if you are rich and want quality - you will overpay in india.

I doubt this. I don’t have experience in India, but I have had lots of medical care in Thailand. Twice now Thai hospitals have found things that my US doctor and US imaging/diagnostic clinics missed. I can get MRI & CT immediately in Thailand, in the same places the doctor works. In the US I have to go to a separate clinic and wait weeks or even months. Cost in Thailand, at the most expensive private hospital (Bumrungrad) typically 1/5 or less US prices.

I also had great experience at public hospital in Taiwan, just walked in and asked for a test. Price was less than 10% for the same procedure in US, with no waiting.

And don’t even start on cost of prescription meds. Americans get scammed.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#122

Post by askonomm »

wkat4242 wrote: post #98
askonomm wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Estonia all of our records (incl. Health) are digitized and online in a central system that both doctors and you can access. It works wonders. Every doctor I go to can see my entire medical history with a press of a button, and I don't have to deal with any of that. Likewise when they prescribe new things, I can see my prescriptions right there, and so forth. We're a 100% online nation now, and clearly when done w…

Are there safeguards in place to prevent the wrong people looking up your data with the touch of a button though? I'm aware of Estonia's digital prowess but for me privacy is a top concern and I'm glad we're not so all-in here.

In the FAQ section of our health portal (https://www.terviseportaal.ee/en/kontaktid-ja-kkk/) it states:

> In Estonia, health information is gathered to the Health Information System, where your prescriptions and medical records are accessible to the health care professionals that provide services to you. The Health Portal enables you to view your data in the Health Information System, submit additional information, and change your personal data. You may restrict your health data if you wish. In that case, health care professionals no longer have access to your health information and the quality of medical care may be impaired, especially in emergency situations.

We take privacy very seriously. We can also see exactly who looked at our data, as there is a log of every person or institute who has done so. A little more is written here: https://e-estonia.com/i-spy-with-my-little-eyeprivacy/

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#123

Post by sega_sai »

short_sells_poo wrote: post #83
CaptainZapp wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The general slowness extends to simple things like x-rays and blood tests too. This is not just US but whole of the west seems to have the exact same attitude. In Switzerland I get an MRI within 48 hours if my doctor orders it. Mind you, healthcare is also very expensive comparatively but the quality is very high and coverage is extensive.

I feel the seiss system really nails it. Health insurance is mandatory. If you can't afford even the basic level, the government pays for it. The basic level itself covers basically everything from emergency care, hospital stays and gp. The extras you can pay for are things like single rooms in hospitals or access to private clinics. Compared to the local salaries, the basic package is quite cheap - doubly so compare…

National insurance contributions have nothing to do with the NHS. NI contributions determine your state pension (but because the money from NI just goes to treasury, NI is really just income tax with different name)

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#124

Post by nope1000 »

evnix wrote: post #71
arjie wrote: post #36

One thing that's surprised me about the US is the general slowness of most things. In India, you can get MRIs and CT Scans same day. Or you could the last time I was there. And it didn't cost very much in comparison. My doctors have all been good (attested to by my parents who are surgeons themselves) but the healthcare system is wonky. One thing I didn't expect is that the Indian system where you just drag your heal…

The general slowness extends to simple things like x-rays and blood tests too. This is not just US but whole of the west seems to have the exact same attitude. Most of Asia has same day or next day medical tests. In India you can order something like UberEats where in a technician comes home collects your blood samples and the results are emailed within the next 24 hours or so. Medicine seems to be commoditzed in the…

I think the problem in the west is just demographics. More older people leads to high demand on the healthcare system and fewer working age people leads to less supply.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#125

Post by vidarh »

xvector wrote: post #96
vidarh wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that I'm trying to make you feel worse about it: In the UK we pay less per capita in taxes toward healthcare than you do in the US (or at least did last I added up the numbers - Medicare and Medicaid alone added up to a higher per capita cost than the NHS), and if we do want private health insurance, which here is basically "queue skip insurance", it costs a fraction of in the US because they only need to provide…

In the UK you also pay insane taxes and your _median_ citizen in the UK has far less disposable income after all expenses including healthcare, according to OECD metrics. In software engineering specifically, I'd make a third of my current income in the UK. I'd much rather make 3x as much in the US and still get free healthcare through my employer, with shorter waiting lists and better treatment outcomes than the NHS…

It's always fun how the strawmen appears instantly when you discuss this subject.

We pay marginally more in tax, sure. How that is relevant to healthcare, however, is a mystery, given we spend less tax money per capita on healthcare than the US does. It's not healthcare that is the reason our taxes are higher, but other services.

I'm sure doctors prefer the US system. That's unsurprising - the US system pays doctors vastly large amounts. It also costs patients vastly larger amounts. So speaking of bias...

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#126

Post by MediumOwl »

short_sells_poo wrote: post #83
CaptainZapp wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The general slowness extends to simple things like x-rays and blood tests too. This is not just US but whole of the west seems to have the exact same attitude. In Switzerland I get an MRI within 48 hours if my doctor orders it. Mind you, healthcare is also very expensive comparatively but the quality is very high and coverage is extensive.

I feel the seiss system really nails it. Health insurance is mandatory. If you can't afford even the basic level, the government pays for it. The basic level itself covers basically everything from emergency care, hospital stays and gp. The extras you can pay for are things like single rooms in hospitals or access to private clinics. Compared to the local salaries, the basic package is quite cheap - doubly so compare…

Does it? It's also close to last in most categories in the linked study.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#127

Post by gregjor »

ein0p wrote: post #8

Lately I can’t even get a doctor - both the specialist and primary care doctors are booked months in advance. And I have one of the best insurance coverages currently available. Remember how we laughed at Canadians and Brits waiting for months to see their free/cheap doctors? Well we’re at a point where we have to wait _and_ pay through the nose. And then they can’t really do anything or fuck you up even worse.

Same. Forced to get insurance through state exchange, premiums over $1,000/mo for two people. Very hard to find a doctor that accepted the insurance. And that was in a major US city. Every test and procedure requires a referral to a specialist, and the game of “do you take this insurance?” repeats. Then you get referred to diagnostic labs with long wait times (sometimes months) and they want payment up front and may not accept your insurance.

That process seems worse in every respect compared to my experience in SE Asia, and the US does not have better outcomes to justify the much higher costs.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#128

Post by inglor_cz »

fire_lake wrote: post #56
askonomm wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Estonia all of our records (incl. Health) are digitized and online in a central system that both doctors and you can access. It works wonders. Every doctor I go to can see my entire medical history with a press of a button, and I don't have to deal with any of that. Likewise when they prescribe new things, I can see my prescriptions right there, and so forth. We're a 100% online nation now, and clearly when done w…

Does one big digital system make a cyber attack more damaging?

Well, they are engaged in constant low-level conflict with Russia, so their systems must be pretty hardened against hostile incursions already.

If there is one EU region where digital security must be taken as a life-and-death matter, it is the Baltics. In case of weakening of NATO, they are the foremost candidates for the next Special Military Operation.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#129

Post by benterix »

evnix wrote: post #71
arjie wrote: post #36

One thing that's surprised me about the US is the general slowness of most things. In India, you can get MRIs and CT Scans same day. Or you could the last time I was there. And it didn't cost very much in comparison. My doctors have all been good (attested to by my parents who are surgeons themselves) but the healthcare system is wonky. One thing I didn't expect is that the Indian system where you just drag your heal…

The general slowness extends to simple things like x-rays and blood tests too. This is not just US but whole of the west seems to have the exact same attitude. Most of Asia has same day or next day medical tests. In India you can order something like UberEats where in a technician comes home collects your blood samples and the results are emailed within the next 24 hours or so. Medicine seems to be commoditzed in the…

I live in Europe and if I take a blood test at 7 am I can usually check the results online by 1 pm.

Re: US health system ranks last compared with peer nations – report

#130

Post by netsharc »

ein0p wrote: post #78
shiroiushi wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why was it "an unachievable pipe dream"? As I remember it, the Democrats had control of both houses of Congress, as well as the White House, for about 2 years. They could have passed anything they wanted.

Because they’re owned by Big Pharma and Big Healthcare. Same as Republicans. Also because we'd much rather fund wars than solve such problems.

I was complaining about the state of discourse on HN the other day. Your comment is example number... I don't know what number, I've lost count.
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