I think the problem that people don't see anymore is using tests themselves. A clever idea is worth more than a single tick in the correct checkbox. This applies to maths as well. Tests are faster to check and, supposedly, objective, but a viva voce exam is still superior imho.
Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
121–130 of 168 posts
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not true. Current research is that experts are better with a ChatGTP, and beginners worse. An expert knows what to ask, and a beginner juat flails around. Tools like calculators, ChatGTP, Google, and chainsaws are often force magnifiers for experts, and a danger for beginners. If you have an idea of what you are trying to do at a deep level then they are great, but beginners don't, they usually just use them as a sho…
> Current research is that experts are better with a ChatGTP, and beginners worse. Current research being your opinion? Because literally every expert I personally know to be competent says that they're essentially garbage producers and don't use them beyond occasionally checking if they've improved. And no, they haven't. The only way to get decent code from them is to be so specific that you'd be able to produce the…
Agreed.. All the co-pilot devs where I work are the juniors. Most of us just type the code we want.
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#123Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is about building [math] skill, not simply calculating a result
sure, but kids education is about building useful skills for life. passing a test is not a useful skill, if the test is useless. teaching kids problem solving and how to be productive is important. maybe that means knowing how to solve certain mathematical equations, maybe that means knowing how to use tools like ChatGPT. focusing on the math just for the sake of passing tests because that's what we've got good tests…
Passing tests is not useless. It shows knowledge at the level of the test.
I write tests for my code and when they fail I know I have to change something. If you're finishing a math test and not passing, then you don't have the skills to solve the problems in said test.
Tests are only useless when you ace them.
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#124Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
I can report that I have learned more about bash scripting in the past couple of years using ChatGPT to write all manner of scripts, than I did in the previous 20 years of copying and pasting things off StackOverflow.
You’re supposed to learn by reading books and doing exercises by yourself ( https://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/ ). SO is equivalent to ChatGPT and will teach you nothing deep.
Yeah, we all learn exactly the same way. We're all great at reading books and following steps in the right order.
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not true. Current research is that experts are better with a ChatGTP, and beginners worse. An expert knows what to ask, and a beginner juat flails around. Tools like calculators, ChatGTP, Google, and chainsaws are often force magnifiers for experts, and a danger for beginners. If you have an idea of what you are trying to do at a deep level then they are great, but beginners don't, they usually just use them as a sho…
> Current research is that experts are better with a ChatGTP, and beginners worse. Current research being your opinion? Because literally every expert I personally know to be competent says that they're essentially garbage producers and don't use them beyond occasionally checking if they've improved. And no, they haven't. The only way to get decent code from them is to be so specific that you'd be able to produce the…
Sorry, it was from a comment, metrics showed senior devs improved, juniors didn't.
But if you want a sketch solution quickly, know the requirements, and can fix the silly mistakes it's a useful tool. Especially if you are doing something where you are rusty, or are used to a slightly different framework or language.
They are like a super fast but slightly clueless junior, who can hammer out mostly correct boilerplate. Not someone you want unsupervised or training a junior, but usefully in some ways.
And yes, boilerplate has disadvantages, but it has its place.
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#127Yeah because it lies and makes stuff up to fill in any gaps.
Re: Kids who use ChatGPT as a study assistant do worse on tests
#128Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Current research is that experts are better with a ChatGTP, and beginners worse. Current research being your opinion? Because literally every expert I personally know to be competent says that they're essentially garbage producers and don't use them beyond occasionally checking if they've improved. And no, they haven't. The only way to get decent code from them is to be so specific that you'd be able to produce the…
Agreed.. All the co-pilot devs where I work are the juniors. Most of us just type the code we want.
Experts are often slower at starting to learn new tricks, because they don't need them, but are better at using them once they do.
But for junior devs, it's often the blind leading the blind.
That said, I don't actually use ChatGTP much. I'm just pretty sure I should in some areas.