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Lynn Conway has died

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Re: Lynn Conway has died

#121

Post by IntelMiner »

nsomaru wrote: post #110
IntelMiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anybody who conflates human rights as "politics" are someone I simply cannot respect A persons right to exist is not political (This isn't a dig at OP but it's worth restating)

Human rights are intimately woven into International Law and state sovereignty. The work of the TWAIL scholars is relevant, especially as regards how human rights are deployed to undermine the sovereignty of the global south following the rapid “decolonisation” of the mid 20th century. I’m afraid it’s almost impossible to divorce politics and human rights.

Politics are intertwined in every facet of the human experience, because they're effectively the net result of a social group

Some people however strive to "live above" politics, or to breathlessly demand things be "apolitical" based on their own biases. That bias in of itself being as "political" as anything else

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#122

Post by polairscience »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #106
polairscience wrote: post #97

For those of you who are inclined to say "HackerNews doesn't deal with politics", I hope that Lynn's story reminds you that any work you do is intertwined with politics. While I appreciate that it's a difficult line to walk, to have productive and relevant political discussion in a forum like this, politics and social acceptance are a part of every aspect of our lives. Brilliant, kind, impactful people are kept from…

> any work you do is intertwined with politics. That simply is not true. Apolitical topics do exist, and it is incredibly annoying when people try to force politics into an apolitical topic (looking at you, Rust community).

While I agree that a community needs to focus on its central goal (developing the rust programming language in this case), I think I have a very good litmus test for what you think "apolitical" means:

Let's say Lynn were a rust developer and felt as though the the tone of the community and the discussion of her work made her feel unwelcome. Let's say Lynn spoke out against that. Would you entertain that conversation? I imagine that is not too far from what happened at IBM when Lynn was fired. When is it "allowed" to be political in your mind?

Intentionally addressing the ability of marginalized people to be a part of a community, in my mind, is precisely apolitical. If it's clear that anyone is welcome then you don't really need to talk about politics, do you.

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#123

Post by bowsamic »

KolmogorovComp wrote: post #58
bo0tzz wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you trying to say?

That as a child seeing a parent struggle deeply has a very strong impact on their wellbeing? This is obviously true, but it is unclear had they not undergone transition the children would have come better. For the children it has probably not been worse than a bad divorce that unfortunately happens way more often. And to pursue the analogy, it is often hard to tell what is best for them, keep an unhappy marriage unti…

One of the main things I’ve learnt undergoing psychoanalysis is how much pain and repression is caused by not allowing ourselves to admit that our parents are not perfect. For example I still to this day try to construct ideal people and am shocked when they show that they are still fallible humans, because I never fully accepted that my dad isn’t perfect, even if I know it intellectually

Going forth into the world and realising it is not going to look after us is a vital realisation that all humans must go through

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#125

Post by dpkirchner »

bowsamic wrote: post #117
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> any work you do is intertwined with politics. That simply is not true. Apolitical topics do exist, and it is incredibly annoying when people try to force politics into an apolitical topic (looking at you, Rust community).

Can you give an example of an apolitical topic? EDIT: unfortunately I can’t reply to the comments as I have been banned EDIT 2: I have been banned to reply to the commenter, dang told me EDIT 3: dang has now wiped all the upvotes on this message and given me 2 extra downvotes and suddenly another comment I made mentioning him in a totally different thread has been mass downvoted

There isn't one. It's the very nature of politics that it affects everything we humans do.

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#126

Post by mminer237 »

IntelMiner wrote: post #102
polairscience wrote: post #97

For those of you who are inclined to say "HackerNews doesn't deal with politics", I hope that Lynn's story reminds you that any work you do is intertwined with politics. While I appreciate that it's a difficult line to walk, to have productive and relevant political discussion in a forum like this, politics and social acceptance are a part of every aspect of our lives. Brilliant, kind, impactful people are kept from…

Anybody who conflates human rights as "politics" are someone I simply cannot respect A persons right to exist is not political (This isn't a dig at OP but it's worth restating)

> A persons right to exist is not political

I don't think anyone is saying anyone else should not exist.

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#127

Post by vaylian »

nsomaru wrote: post #110
IntelMiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anybody who conflates human rights as "politics" are someone I simply cannot respect A persons right to exist is not political (This isn't a dig at OP but it's worth restating)

Human rights are intimately woven into International Law and state sovereignty. The work of the TWAIL scholars is relevant, especially as regards how human rights are deployed to undermine the sovereignty of the global south following the rapid “decolonisation” of the mid 20th century. I’m afraid it’s almost impossible to divorce politics and human rights.

Politics follow ethics in democratic societies. However, our understanding of ethics is always developing. We now understand that homosexuality is ethical. We understand that transgenderism is ethical. There will be more things in the future where politics has to bow to our improved understanding of ethics. Ethics is always a foundation for democratic politics, because politics needs to govern how we as a society live together in peace.

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#129

Post by BSDobelix »

nsomaru wrote: post #110
IntelMiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anybody who conflates human rights as "politics" are someone I simply cannot respect A persons right to exist is not political (This isn't a dig at OP but it's worth restating)

Human rights are intimately woven into International Law and state sovereignty. The work of the TWAIL scholars is relevant, especially as regards how human rights are deployed to undermine the sovereignty of the global south following the rapid “decolonisation” of the mid 20th century. I’m afraid it’s almost impossible to divorce politics and human rights.

>I’m afraid it’s almost impossible to divorce politics and human rights.

It is, example?

Nord Korea signed it, the US and Canada just ratified it:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_on_the_Rights_of_th...

Re: Lynn Conway has died

#130

Post by number6 »

nsomaru wrote: post #110
IntelMiner wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anybody who conflates human rights as "politics" are someone I simply cannot respect A persons right to exist is not political (This isn't a dig at OP but it's worth restating)

Human rights are intimately woven into International Law and state sovereignty. The work of the TWAIL scholars is relevant, especially as regards how human rights are deployed to undermine the sovereignty of the global south following the rapid “decolonisation” of the mid 20th century. I’m afraid it’s almost impossible to divorce politics and human rights.

First time I heard about TWAIL. Ok, now human rights are controversial? The one ideal, that whoever you are, wherever you are, you hold universal rights because you are a human. This are Western ideas and are not true for the global south? This belief is weaponized?

I cannot believe this. Simply outrageous. I never understood the religious people before - to me this is a sacrilege.

Universal human rights are the hill I will literally die on.

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