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iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

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Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#121

Post by soraminazuki »

janice1999 wrote: post #83
weinzierl wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On a technical level there is no relevant difference but on a social level there well is, in my opinion. The expectation is that plugins need to be activated explicitly and that do not get installed or activated automatically. Even stronger, a common impression about plugins is, that they are often a pain to install and get working. I know that this expectation has been violated occasionally in one form or another bu…

I completely agree. We often forget it's not always about the technical details of the implementation. Its about the attitude of developers and their relationship with their users and those users expectations. Users are 100% correct to be skeptical or even worried when they hear "AI integration". Putting it into the "core" makes a clear statement about the projects intentions. The developer recognizes this by saying…

The developer did listen and came up with a change. All the while enduring insults, threats, and lies directed at him in the GitLab thread and all over the internet. Yet you attack him [*] for being slightly emotional in his response this one time? Wow.

Speaking of attitude, iTerm2 is a gift, and some users (or maybe even non-users) appear to be in need of a reminding.

[*]: Your top level comment

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#122

Post by jaredcwhite »

Cu3PO42 wrote: post #22

I feel really sorry for the developer. I've only been a casual observer, but from my view point the community's reaction was... not great, to put it lightly. I get that a lot of us are tired of 'AI' being shoved down our throat at every possible turn. I get that a lot of us have privacy concerns. I get that maybe you don't want it in your terminal emulator. But iTerm is a free (both as in gratis and as in libre) open…

> I think this is a good change, if only to pacify the masses

It has nothing to do with "pacifying the masses" and everything to do it with being the right product decision to make. It should never have been added to core and should have been offered as a 100% optional add-on in the first place. People had every right to be deeply upset.

We run into this problem constantly with cloud software where we have zero control over what features they add (aka AI) and often there's no way to opt-out. Thankfully we can expect better from a locally-executing open source terminal app.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#123

Post by jaredcwhite »

glhaynes wrote: post #13

People are making their whole personalities about being anti-AI. I'm personally a mix of skeptical+worried about AI; but at some point just being a reactionary ninny makes people tune out on whether there might be some truth at the core of your concern.

Luddites are making their whole personalities about being anti-exploitation of labor by capitalists. /s

Love how you just lump everyone who take their time to voice legitimate concerns about the ethical and privacy nightmare that is proprietary generative AI services into a category called "reactionary ninnies".

While I'm sure some comments went overboard, people had every right to be upset about this integration being added to iTerm—even as a configure-to-use-it feature. I'm glad this is being extracted out to a completely separate add-on.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#124

Post by soraminazuki »

mhurron wrote: post #60
atkailash wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. You have to provide it your own API key. If you don’t want it, don’t put it in and bam, no problem

Except that it can be. As was pointed out in the original issue to remove it, the feature is not disabled, it is unconfigured. Put anything in the box for the OpenAI key, valid or not, and the functionality to send data to OpenAI is active. Accidentally put a [space] in that box and it looks like there is nothing there, but it's doing things you didn't expect. That was the wrong way to do it. The feature should have…

> the feature is not disabled, it is unconfigured

It doesn't do anything at all unless you actively engage with it. This is sophistry at its finest.

> Put anything in the box for the OpenAI key, valid or not, and the functionality to send data to OpenAI is active.

No it isn't. Nothing happens until you bring up the Codecierge toolbox and type in a question.

Also, from your later comment:

> 'prompt to use OpenAI' is not OpenAI specific, it is a new button in a previous function that you could use in earlier versions

You just made that one up, the Codecierge UI is entirely new.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#125

Post by hwbehrens »

Xelynega wrote: post #97
hwbehrens wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the attitude of the developer in the response has certainly convinced me to never become one If you are a Mac user and not using (or at least considering) iTerm2, you are doing yourself a disservice. It is by far the best terminal emulator available and runs circles around the built-in option. If you are a not a Mac user, then the entire discussion is moot either way.

iTerm is pretty mid for a mac terminal emulator in my opinion. Before it I would recommend kitty or alacritty.

Thanks for the recommendations! I checked them both out, but for me iTerm is still a better fit. I think of my Mac terminal as my viewer into the lower level, and not as the lower level, and the batteries-included approach that iTerm takes (e.g. having a UI for manipulating the settings file) is better aligned with that view.

FWIW, they both seem extremely performant and would probably be a great fit if I daily-drove Linux.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#126

Post by wpm »

galad87 wrote: post #101
leetcrew wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

apple and microsoft have historically provided ways of turning off features that their corporate customers don't want. I doubt this will be any different.

iTerm AI feature was off by default and you had to manually insert a valid key, but it seems it was still an issue.

The change notes nor the UI do not imply this.

All this needs was a single checkbox “Disable OpenAI Integration” or codecierge or whatever it’s called. A single, unequivocal “this is not enabled” signal to the user who does not want or cannot what this feature enabled.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#127

Post by rsynnott »

boringg wrote: post #74
mmastrac wrote: post #3

The whole drama was pretty silly, and the fact that everyone got upset that a feature that is inactive by default, consumes no processing power, memory or anything else and bullied the author of the open-source program should make everyone unhappy. This is why open-source maintainers burn out and we can't have nice things. Honestly, people, please consider the human on the other side of the toxic discourse.

Agree - it really speaks to the issues around AI and how wrought that conversation has become. To your point that it is turned of by default - you have to opt in if you want it.

It's mere possible presence would probably be enough to get iTerm banned from more security-conscious companies, tho.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#128

Post by rsynnott »

mike_hearn wrote: post #110
_fat_santa wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To allow developers in restrictive but technically incompetent organizations to continue to use iTerm2 I mean sure it was a brash way of putting it but he's not wrong. I contract with an org that basically shuts off access to anything that is in any way related to AI, we can't even visit the OpenAI website on our computers. If this feature was part of core iTerm2 then 100% they would have banned the use of iTerm.

So they're going to take away MS Office, Windows, Google and Bing too are they? With iTerm it's not even using AI unless you give it an API key, so the whole thing is a storm in a teacup.

Microsoft knows its customers, and presumably provides a method for enterprises to nuke the 'AI' features. A lot of companies absolutely would not adopt an Office update with mandatory LLM.

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#129

Post by Suzuran »

soraminazuki wrote: post #120
Suzuran wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the issue is lack of trust in iTerm2, it's lack of trust in the corporations who operate the AI services and have very strong (profit) incentives to abuse and/or exploit all data they can collect by any means necessary. The technology isn't the problem; It's the meatbags weaponizing it in the name of a quick buck who are the problem. Before this recent flare-up in pro/anti-AI tribalism, I have not regul…

No, people are saying, don't use the feature if you're not interested. It isn't hard. Don't input an API key. Don't do multiple clicks to show the "Codecierge" toolbox. Don't type in a question for the AI. In future versions, don't install the optional AI plugin. And crucially, don't act the way people did in this saga and be civil. Follow any of that, and you're fine. People aren't demanding you anything. You are.

You missed the point, or I failed to adequately explain it. I know full well (now, without the intentional disinformation that was being spread earlier) that the feature is entirely disabled without an API key present. I understand that, as things stand right now, the decision of whether or not to engage with OpenAI through iTerm2 is entirely mine.

My point is that I believe the reason people are still repulsed by it to such a high degree is not because they all have some irrational deep-seated hatred of the AI technology, but that they are repulsed by the idea of even accidentally engaging with the OpenAI corporation (who just announced a partnership with News Corp of all things...); They are terrified of some situation in the future where someone comes along with code or packet traces and says "Hey, look at this, OpenAI has all your data anyway, and there's nothing you can do about it but seethe and cope; sucks to be you!"

Re: iTerm2 removes AI feature from core, creates separate plugin

#130

Post by Suzuran »

ThrowawayTestr wrote: post #118
Suzuran wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the issue is lack of trust in iTerm2, it's lack of trust in the corporations who operate the AI services and have very strong (profit) incentives to abuse and/or exploit all data they can collect by any means necessary. The technology isn't the problem; It's the meatbags weaponizing it in the name of a quick buck who are the problem. Before this recent flare-up in pro/anti-AI tribalism, I have not regul…

>it's lack of trust in the corporations who operate the AI services Then don't use the feature?

You missed my point, or I failed to adequately explain it; Please see my response to the comment above yours.
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