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Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

theguardian.com

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Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#121
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are urban areas. If you instead count by city limits, Berlin is bigger by a large margin [1]. This is the perpetual problem with defining "biggest" - to some the urban area of Paris might still be "Paris" but the vast majority of it is outside the city limits. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_the_European...

The urban area is what matters. Paris is larger than Berlin and the largest in the EU. Paris has the specificity of having small limits for the city proper but it does not make sense to use that metric for comparison because nowadays the city only stops at the administrative limits for adminsitrative purposes and nothing else. You won't even notice you've crossed the limit if not for the ring road. In fact, Moscow is…

The urban area of Paris ("aire d'attraction de Paris") extends well past the areas where people would consider that they are "in Paris".

It might well still be the biggest in the EU if you drew limits based on what people considered part of the city - I don't know - but it certainly would not be as big as its urban area.

In fact, I'd argue you're unlikely to find any major city anywhere in the world where most people would agree that every part of the outer boundaries of the urban area are part of "the city" (or even "a city"; parts of urban areas will still often be considered fairly rural by those who live there or in the nearby city) even in a loose colloquial or cultural sense. Even coming close would be exceedingly rare. This because the ways urban areas are designated by design tends to include commuter regions far outside, with their own identities, and often very separated from the biggest city in the urban area.

So while going by city limits will be misleading, so will going by urban area. Unfortunately, no single metric will be accurate for these things.

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EDM isn't Techno. It's a bit like saying that hard rock is like metal (somewhat bad analogy, but I hope you get the point). I know you listed a range of genres but it's important to note that the Berlin techno scene would never consider itself part of EDM. In Europe, most EDM is happening in Amsterdam.

Can you distinguish these two? In my head EDM & techno occupy the same space.

Compare:

* Plastikman: Spastik: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TYsOMYaz6E (minimal techno)

* Fred Again: Pull Me Out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl6Rz1Uvi2M (house / "EDM")

(EDM is more a US term than a European one, IME.)

I think the differences in style are quite obvious.

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just don’t queue an hour at Mustafa's - it’s good Kebap, but it’s not that extraordinary. Rüya(m), Superhahn or Servet's make the same style of Gemüsekebap and are just as good.

Why go to Germany to get a Turkish meal? Any kebab in Istanbul is going to be better than whatever is available in Berlin. Better get some Schweinshaxe mit Sauerkraut...

Okay I am German and I can tell you I don't know anyone who prefers Schweinshaxe to a good döner kebab. Which by the way, funnily enough, was invented in Germany by Kadir Nurman, a Berliner!

It's basically our national dish at this point and we're arguably better off for it. Our more traditional cuisine is... not so great.

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#126
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Berghain's door policy mostly still works: keeps the American tourists out and the club good times. It's starting to feel a bit dated in general, like the moment's moving past it, but it's always a good time.

I agree, as ruthless as the door policy is every single time I've been there I had a good time, the crowd inside knew what they were there for and what the scene is about. To me personally since the big room/celebrity techno DJs took more space in the scene it has become much harder to find dancefloors like Berghain. I'm still sad for De School closing in Amsterdam, it was a very different place than Berghain but the…

Totally. Skrillex at bhain is some end times shit

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#127
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The urban area is what matters. Paris is larger than Berlin and the largest in the EU. Paris has the specificity of having small limits for the city proper but it does not make sense to use that metric for comparison because nowadays the city only stops at the administrative limits for adminsitrative purposes and nothing else. You won't even notice you've crossed the limit if not for the ring road. In fact, Moscow is…

The urban area of Paris ("aire d'attraction de Paris") extends well past the areas where people would consider that they are "in Paris". It might well still be the biggest in the EU if you drew limits based on what people considered part of the city - I don't know - but it certainly would not be as big as its urban area. In fact, I'd argue you're unlikely to find any major city anywhere in the world where most people…

[deleted]

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you distinguish these two? In my head EDM & techno occupy the same space.

Compare: * Plastikman: Spastik: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TYsOMYaz6E (minimal techno) * Fred Again: Pull Me Out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl6Rz1Uvi2M (house / "EDM") (EDM is more a US term than a European one, IME.) I think the differences in style are quite obvious.

Ahhh Ritchie Hawtin. Legend!

A friend was playing this in a bar last night and it took me back.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yWOtCXu6dCE&pp=ygUTc3lzdGVtIDc...

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#129
Not enough mention of LGBT, especially gay male, scenes, which are the foundation of German techno. Until very recently, Berghain was a gay club that plays techno, not a techno club that supports gay people. Many Berlin clubs are still gay orgies, including the ocassional basement show in Berghain, but more famously kitkat club.

I agree the scene is "dying" though, simply because Berlin is very different than it was 20 or 30 years ago. Robert Henke (Monolake) talks about this: after the wall collapsed, the factories in east Berlin were abandoned, and west Berlin were happily giving permission and even some money to any student who wanted to open an "artistic space" in one of the old factories. So it was easy, you had a very industrial space, you brought some speakers and some beer along, and suddenly you had a club.

This is basically a very rare cultural moment: large amounts of unused industrial space being given away to anyone who wants to party. Berlin is, of course, nothing like this now.

Re: Berlin's techno scene added to Unesco intangible cultural heritage list

#130

Every DJ and producer that goes to Berlin to do a "residency" comes back sounding the same and I hate it.

Hardwax.com still has the great picks, I definitely recommend looking there if you want great Berlin techno (and ambient, electro, etc.) that doesn't sound like the stale genre "Berlin techno"
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