Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling • Hacker News Board

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#121

Post by TN1ck » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:14 PM UTC

TonyTrapp wrote: post #93

nerdjon wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is an interesting thing to think about, I have friends that use Windows that are shocked that I willingly chose to get an external trackpad when I use my Mac as desktop. Even more interesting is when I see my partner try to do something on my Mac using a trackpad, he seems... apprehensive? Like he is so afraid of doing the wrong thing and for me this trackpad has never done something I didn't want it to do. Like w…

> Even more interesting is when I see my partner try to do something on my Mac using a trackpad, he seems... apprehensive? Like he is so afraid of doing the wrong thing and for me this trackpad has never done something I didn't want it to do. Like without even thinking about it while I was re-reading this comment, I had fingers just resting on my trackpad. I think I'll never "get" drag&drop on MacBook touchpads. Ever…

Try accessibility settings and then 3 finger drag (switching spaces will become 4 fingers). It works really great and makes working in design tools feasible.

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#122

Post by pmontra » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:14 PM UTC

nerdjon wrote: post #59

al_borland wrote: post #6

Why does this seem like such a hard problem to solve for everyone that isn’t Apple, when Apple seemingly solved the Trackpad over a decade ago? Is this it? An unknown ROI? >the highly uncertain ROI for trying to align touchpad acceleration has prevented us from proposing a system change to the default Linux settings. I can only speak for myself, but I gave up using trackpads on anything that isn’t a MacBook many year…

It is an interesting thing to think about, I have friends that use Windows that are shocked that I willingly chose to get an external trackpad when I use my Mac as desktop. Even more interesting is when I see my partner try to do something on my Mac using a trackpad, he seems... apprehensive? Like he is so afraid of doing the wrong thing and for me this trackpad has never done something I didn't want it to do. Like w…

If I'll ever use a desktop again I also want an external touchpad and I want to place it in front of the keyboard like on a laptop. But you wrote trackpad. It's it the one with the ball? Probably not because you also wrote about multitouch. So, which trackpad do you use?

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#123

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:16 PM UTC

marcodiego wrote: post #84

distantsounds wrote: post #77

2024 is the Year of the Linux Desktop! This _surely_ is a sign we're going to get it, right? Right?

We all know the "Year of the Linux Desktop" meme, but this deserves an answer. I don't think linux will overtake apple on the desktop (which actually includes notebook and laptops) but the current state has been good enough for a few years. And I'm not saying it is good enough only in terms of it being ready or well rounded, I mean in terms of marketshare. Linux has surpassed the 4% mark in globalstats last month and…

[deleted]

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#124

Post by rad_gruchalski » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:18 PM UTC

al_borland wrote: post #6

Why does this seem like such a hard problem to solve for everyone that isn’t Apple, when Apple seemingly solved the Trackpad over a decade ago? Is this it? An unknown ROI? >the highly uncertain ROI for trying to align touchpad acceleration has prevented us from proposing a system change to the default Linux settings. I can only speak for myself, but I gave up using trackpads on anything that isn’t a MacBook many year…

> Why does this seem like such a hard problem to solve for everyone that isn’t Apple, when Apple seemingly solved the Trackpad over a decade ago?

Patents?

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#125

Post by pmontra » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:18 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #92

bheadmaster wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they will have a more expensive laptop with nothing to show for it on the label, and customers will buy cheaper ones with "the same specs". You can't really put "better touchpad" on a label... or can you?

Why couldn't they? Why is a trackpad different than better speakers or camera or battery runtime or having quiet fans?

They should invent a measurement unit for trackpads/touchpads, whatever we call them. Then a grade 5 touchpad will be immediately perceived as better than a grade 4 one. Or Basic, Business, Elite. Marketing teams are good at that.

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#126

Post by jwells89 » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:19 PM UTC

methyl wrote: post #120

jwells89 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing that might make a difference is that for a long time now, Apple trackpads are actually touchscreens sans screen. They use the same multitouch hardware as iPhones and iPads, which of course are precise and responsive. I would guess that these are probably a bit more expensive than your run of the mill trackpad from e.g. Synaptics that ends up in the typical laptop.

I thought so, but then installing Asahi results in terrible trackpad experience even though the hardware is the same.

It’s not hardware alone for certain. You need good software and hardware, with the latter defining the upper bounds of how good the former can be.

I’ve experienced the reverse with macOS running on generic laptops via hackintoshing. Potato trackpads are still potatoes under macOS.

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#127

Post by RIMR » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:20 PM UTC

asdff wrote: post #68

zozbot234 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Magic mouse only has only one button, like all Apple mice. It relies on touch detection to fake multiple button support.

This basically makes their mice unusable for certain things like gaming. I had to use their mouse for a while and I opted to bind right click to a keyboard button because what do you know, most games bind aim and shoot to right and left click.

Apple has never prioritized gaming on their devices.

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#128

Post by palata » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:20 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #92

bheadmaster wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they will have a more expensive laptop with nothing to show for it on the label, and customers will buy cheaper ones with "the same specs". You can't really put "better touchpad" on a label... or can you?

Why couldn't they? Why is a trackpad different than better speakers or camera or battery runtime or having quiet fans?

Because those who make that choice believe (or have data proving it, but my feeling is that usually they just believe) that users are too dumb to understand.

That's a real problem in many situations: users are often under-estimated (they are also often dumb, which doesn't help).

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#129

Post by viraptor » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:23 PM UTC

LorenDB wrote: post #89

circuit10 wrote: post #16

The main thing I think is missing is universal support for kinetic/inertial scrolling, where you can fling your fingers on the touchpad and it keeps going after you stop. It seems to work with GTK but not Qt

I would find that incredibly annoying for touchpad inputs. Sure, I can understand kinetic input for touchscreens, but touchpads should be precision inputs, not the sort of thing where accidentally bumping two fingers on the touchpad sends you two pages down.

It doesn't have to. That's why there are usually various thresholds when dealing with input devices. Like dead zones in controllers. Ideally you should both have inertial scrolling when you intend it and precise scrolling when you don't.

Re: Linux Touchpad Like MacBook Update: 2023 Progress on Smooth Scrolling

#130

Post by palata » Tue, Mar 05, 2024, 10:25 PM UTC

marcodiego wrote: post #84

distantsounds wrote: post #77

2024 is the Year of the Linux Desktop! This _surely_ is a sign we're going to get it, right? Right?

We all know the "Year of the Linux Desktop" meme, but this deserves an answer. I don't think linux will overtake apple on the desktop (which actually includes notebook and laptops) but the current state has been good enough for a few years. And I'm not saying it is good enough only in terms of it being ready or well rounded, I mean in terms of marketshare. Linux has surpassed the 4% mark in globalstats last month and…

Also... I don't really want Linux on the Desktop to beat macOS/Windows. Because at that point it will be just like macOS/Windows, and I am not on Linux for that.

I often see complaints that Linux on the Desktop is not enough like macOS/Windows, and I never understand: why use Linux then? I want Linux because of what it is now, not because I want a free macOS/Windows.