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Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

bsky.social

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Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#121

Post by basil-rash »

hellojesus wrote: post #101
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Doesn't Twitter like most socials feed you things with which they predict would increase your engagement or time on platform? If the GP's social circle leaned more conservative than them, it may just be bad predictions. And I can see how that would degrade user experience. I often hear things like X service skews left/right and find it odd that people can have such differing experiences. Hence my belief that the feed…

When somebody else is wrong on the internet, one feels compelled to comment and explain one’s righteousness, or at the very least read through the comments to see if somebody else already has. Thus algorithms that optimize engagement (most of them) are most likely to show you stuff you disagree with.

The antidote is Linkedinification: “Thanks for bringing up this point it’s really smart and I fully agree!”

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#122

Post by steveklabnik »

ThinkBeat wrote: post #100

This I applaud as the tech in me. It will quickly become a mess in the real world. People will run pods on cheapest VPS and they will get hacked, run out of money, get bored, go broke etc. Imagine as fractions of content goes missing for a while or is just deleted. One guy runs a small pod with some people, kills it, 60.000 messages gone. How does that impact interconnected discussions? If I own my own data. (good),…

> If not, if the content remains stored somehow then I dont own my data and I cant remove it?

This is true of any federated system. Once you put things out into the world, you can ask that others delete it, but that doesn't mean they will.

Even in centralized systems, things like archive.org exist.

In some sense, public statements are always immutable.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#123

Post by j-james »

steveklabnik wrote: post #63
mm263 wrote: post #4

I think they nailed every Mastodon criticism that I've heard floating around and addressed it, however I'm especially curious to learn about the moderation layer in-depth.

> I'm especially curious to learn about the moderation layer in-depth. You'll want to read: * "Composable Moderation," this is the core conceptual idea: https://bsky.social/about/blog/4-13-2023-moderation * "Moderation in a Public Commons," which describes specific features that were added in pursuit of the previously-described goal https://bsky.social/about/blog/6-23-2023-moderation-proposal... * "Bluesky 2023 Moder…

I cannot see how BlueSky's moderation system can ever work. Decoupling moderation and hosting means there's no onus to do the moderation that they describe: which makes me think it will be BlueSky Inc., and only other corporations, that have resources to throw employees at a now thankless, Facebook-style moderation job. And instances have to moderate anyway, in order to not host illegal content.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#124

Post by mort96 »

steveklabnik wrote: post #99
micromacrofoot wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right I didn't mean to get into the business aspect, but essentially "what prevents someone from undoing this for money." Thanks for the detail.

It's all good. The Jack thing is, in my mind, a bit sensitive, because a lot of people criticizing BlueSky talk as though Jack runs the place, owns it, etc, all of which seems factually incorrect. He has a board seat, but seemingly cares about it so little that he deleted his account. From what I hear, nostr is his focus, but I'm not on there so I can't speak to that personally.

Jack has certainly been successful in building a general perception that bsky is "the Twitter founder's" next social network project, intentionally or otherwise

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#125

Post by mightyham »

jakebsky wrote: post #5

Hey HN, the engineering team at Bluesky is especially excited to get to this point! We're happy to help answer questions and help anyone trying to run their own PDS host. Things should work pretty well for self-hosters right now, but we're standing by to help if there are any problems. Technical details and the installer are in the GitHub repo https://github.com/bluesky-social/pds And we're on Discord available to he…

I'm a little confused why the PDS server is both dockerized and has an installation exclusive to Ubuntu/Debian.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#127

Post by mvdtnz »

eropple wrote: post #111
mvdtnz wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No video in 2024 is a total deal breaker for most users. That's insane.

Video is also prohibitively expensive outside of Google-scale endeavors and will likely crush both third-party BGSes and PDSes. Everyone doing video is either selling you ads (whether it's in that video or around it), selling you the video itself, or is losing money. Possibly all three. As it is, og-embeds do work for video and audio from a few different providers.

Great. But without video you lose most of your users.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#128

Post by MaxHoppersGhost »

emceestork wrote: post #118
sergiotapia wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Twitter is a conservative cesspool I disagree. If anything now it's more balanced, every "right of Portland-liberal" is no longer hidden and shadow-banned or worse. I like it a lot more! Now you can actually read and learn about stuff you care about.

Yeah, maybe we just have different politics and I'm too dismissive of alternative worldviews. Still though, I get like Matt Gaetz' tweets recommended to me. Does anyone like that dude? How is this happening? Why on earth would I want that? I feel like all this conservative stuff is surfaced by the application to me. [Proof]( https://ibb.co/ypHS8fN ) I got notifications, on my dang phone, for the dumbest fucking takes…

This is funny to read since this is basically what conservatives experienced for the last ten years on Twitter pre-Elon.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#129

Post by steveklabnik »

j-james wrote: post #123
steveklabnik wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm especially curious to learn about the moderation layer in-depth. You'll want to read: * "Composable Moderation," this is the core conceptual idea: https://bsky.social/about/blog/4-13-2023-moderation * "Moderation in a Public Commons," which describes specific features that were added in pursuit of the previously-described goal https://bsky.social/about/blog/6-23-2023-moderation-proposal... * "Bluesky 2023 Moder…

I cannot see how BlueSky's moderation system can ever work. Decoupling moderation and hosting means there's no onus to do the moderation that they describe: which makes me think it will be BlueSky Inc., and only other corporations, that have resources to throw employees at a now thankless, Facebook-style moderation job. And instances have to moderate anyway , in order to not host illegal content.

I hear you on some level. That said, we are already seeing people creating blocklists, and tools to share them with others. That is happening alongside the company's investment in paying people to work on T&S related issues on their instance.

I am not sure if it will succeed or fail, but I am interested to see how it plays out.

Re: Bluesky announces data federation for self hosters

#130

Post by r14c »

steveklabnik wrote: post #12
r14c wrote: post #8

I hope someone comes up with a multi-protocol social server. Bridges are a bad architecture for decentralized systems, because they introduce single points of failure. I can understand using a read-only bridge to mirror content from external resources, but if the other side speaks a federation protocol you should find a way to communicate directly so you don't have to worry about intermediary failures.

Someone has been working on a bridge between BlueSky and Mastodon, and uh, it has generated a TREMENDOUS amount of controversy on the Mastodon side. I have my own biases so I don't want to describe it further than that, nor link to it directly so as not to cause even more disagreement, but the controversy does not seem to faze the developer, so I believe you will have your wish.

A global bridge isn't a multi-protocol social server. The guy is free to do as he likes, but I'm saying I don't think public bridges like that are a good architectural decision for decentralized networks. The individual nodes should implement multi-protocol support instead.
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