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USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

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Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#121
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because chemistry and IT/swe are not the same jobs. And America also needs chemists

Based on pay, I would guess chemists aren't in demand.

That’s not how the market works. It doesn’t go “oh we need chemists let’s increase their pay and they’ll flock here”. It goes “oh I guess we let our science skills rot for 20 years it seems really hard to do chemistry now let’s pivot the business into a glorified real estate holding and invest in those ad companies that seem to have good ROI”.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not being hyperbolic, ALL of H1B friends I personally know makes 250+ total comp. Many makes around that in base salary. ( most my friends are late 20 and early 30s )

Are they really doing jobs that Americans wouldn't or couldn't do for that amount? Honestly curious about your opinion, since they are your friends.

Why would companies go through the hassle of getting H1B workers, if they could hire Americans for the same job at the same amount?

Clearly there has to be either a shortage of the type of worker, or the Americans want a higher pay.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#123
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some pushback on your logic chain: > foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens This is honestly rare, unless you couple it with a wage level that is lower than the domestic market will bear. Some individuals involved in R&D, but outside of that there are few skills that are not found in the US. I believe the condition isn't not found, but rather, in low supply? > make the visa transferrab…

Experienced coders don’t magically appear because salaries go up.

They actually do?

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#124

One thing I find really, really weird about the US immigration system is that immigrating illegally is trivial (apparently even more so nowadays than it was 15 years ago), and it even comes with a loophole that can make you a legal immigrant later, yet legal immigration is a very tedious and often impossible path. I have a relative that 15-ish years ago simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 year…

> simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 years later...

How did he make money during those 5 years?

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#125

One thing I find really, really weird about the US immigration system is that immigrating illegally is trivial (apparently even more so nowadays than it was 15 years ago), and it even comes with a loophole that can make you a legal immigrant later, yet legal immigration is a very tedious and often impossible path. I have a relative that 15-ish years ago simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 year…

> And for many people from oversubscribed countries (like India and China), marrying a US citizen is the ONLY viable path to a green card. That's obviously not true, by both analysis and observation.

How so? There’s a 100+ year wait on EB2 and EB3 Green Cards for people born in India. Only 7% of GCs can go to people of any one country. At the current cap of 49000, it means only 3400 EB2 GCs can actually be issued to Indians per year. An approved application doesn’t equate to a green card actually minted and issued. There’s a 12 year backlog on applications alone. (https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/legal/visa-law0/v...)

H1B is neither a green card nor a path to one.

There is one category that has no cap at all however. The “Immediate relative of a US citizen” one.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#126

One thing I find really, really weird about the US immigration system is that immigrating illegally is trivial (apparently even more so nowadays than it was 15 years ago), and it even comes with a loophole that can make you a legal immigrant later, yet legal immigration is a very tedious and often impossible path. I have a relative that 15-ish years ago simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 year…

Having been through it myself, I agree that US immigration is fundamentally broken. With that being said:

> One thing I find really, really weird about the US immigration system is that immigrating illegally is trivial (apparently even more so nowadays than it was 15 years ago)

For the immigrants most at risk (not the ones overstaying visas), this has never been true. Many immigrants have to cross the Darien Gap: https://www.cfr.org/article/crossing-darien-gap-migrants-ris...

The system had serious negative consequences on my health, but my personal suffering isn't even a hundredth as bad as what hundreds of thousands have gone through.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#127

One thing I find really, really weird about the US immigration system is that immigrating illegally is trivial (apparently even more so nowadays than it was 15 years ago), and it even comes with a loophole that can make you a legal immigrant later, yet legal immigration is a very tedious and often impossible path. I have a relative that 15-ish years ago simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 year…

> simply overstayed their tourist visa and never left. Some 5 years later... How did he make money during those 5 years?

> How did he make money during those 5 years?

Worked in jobs that didn’t ask for proof of employment authorization.

Being white also probably helped a lot. I’m actually willing to bet that most americans aren’t even aware that white people can also immigrate illegally.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#128
post #4

It seems like it would be so easy to fix the H1-B program but no one wants to and I feel like I must be missing something. The purpose of the H1-B is to allow companies to hire foreigners with special skills that can't be found amongst US citizens. So why not just grant H1-Bs to the companies that are willing to pay their talent the most? Let any company apply and list a salary which they have to agree to pay for at…

The fact that the U.S. immigration system is so obviously broken is the topic on which I am most vulnerable to conspiracy theories. It just makes no sense. From the Southern border to H1-B, it looks designed to anger and disappoint every single stakeholder (excepting the businesses who employ illegal immigrants for poor wages).

The system as it currently stands was a quick hack on the prior, explicitly racist immigration system we had before the Civil Rights Act. To be clear, there was no Congressional will for racially equitable immigration at the time. They wanted to keep the immigration system white without having to have the words "white race" in the text of the bill. So instead they changed the system to heavily favor family sponsorship, under the idea that white people would just keep sponsoring other white people and that would keep the system white.

Now, it'll probably be a shock to you, but these family sponsorship visas actually make America's immigrant pool way less white. It may not feel like it if you're trying to get an immigrant visa on an employment basis, but America is actually one of the easiest countries to immigrate to if you have relatives here. Other developed countries are far more selective and bureaucratic.

The trick is to recognize that nobody agrees on what part of the system is actually broken. The DNC said the quiet part out loud[0], but the GOP has been thinking for decades that immigration was just a way to dilute Republican voters. A good chunk of the GOP thinks the problem is that it's too easy to immigrate and we need to become like Japan[1]. Another chunk doesn't care about immigrants, but they want to end illegal immigration by any means necessary. The DNC wants, at a minimum, immigration amnesty with a path to citizenship[3]. And then you have business interests that maximally exploit immigrants, legal or otherwise. None of those positions are reconcilable in a way that will produce an immigration bill that will pass the House, Senate, and President Biden.

[0] "Demographics is destiny", which was DNC-speak for "Hillary Clinton can't possibly lose because we have enough Mexicans in California".

[1] As a massive weeaboo[2] I do not understand why anyone would want to adopt Japanese immigration standards.

[2] "Japanophile", but a different, derogatory term I won't use; wordfiltered by 4chan to a word they stole from https://pbfcomics.com/comics/weeaboo/

[3] Keep in mind that there are two classes of illegal immigration:

- People who just moved in without the proper visa, have been here for decades, have no intention of going back, and are already integrated with their local communities. Deporting them would be needlessly cruel.

- Agricultural companies who are importing massive amounts of day laborers from Mexico to avoid having to pay minimum wage

You can argue that the former should have amnesty while still wanting to have a functional minimum wage law by stopping the latter.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are they really doing jobs that Americans wouldn't or couldn't do for that amount? Honestly curious about your opinion, since they are your friends.

Why would companies go through the hassle of getting H1B workers, if they could hire Americans for the same job at the same amount? Clearly there has to be either a shortage of the type of worker, or the Americans want a higher pay.

Some healthy subset of companies just want to hire the best people they can get that will accept their offer, and sponsoring an h1b is a small part of the overall costs.

Re: USCIS announces strengthened integrity measures for H-1B program

#130
post #94
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ideally the admin would ban bodyshops from using the H-1B process, but that'd stop their benefactors' sources of cheap labor.

Ideally the admin should close H1B for few years until job market recovers.

Here's what will happen if they do that: A large number of universities will go under without tuition fees from international students.

Professors will leave these universities to pursue industry careers, soneven if the job market recovers the universities won't.

Without competent specialized people from the universities, US will lose the tech edge very very quickly. Cutting edge tech requires a large number of people willing to slog through several years of training.

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