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Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

theguardian.com

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Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#121

Post by smileysteve »

redleggedfrog wrote: post #76
taeric wrote: post #7

That has included me, in the past. It is stupid easy to accidentally have a debt to a hospital. For families, sensible privacy rules at clinics can mean that it is very hard to choke point bills to a single person. To the point that I asked every time if I owed money when I did checkups to be told that we did not. Only to later find that my family did, in fact, have a bill due. For a while. Recently I'm getting it wi…

I, and my family, are now literally asking on every single thing, "Is that covered by my insurance? Will I be billed extra for that?" Like, over and over. Stupid system, stupid questions. At a recent minor surgery I must have asked it 10 times, and once for these little grippy socks they wanted to give me for my bare feet. And yup, they cost extra. So, get 'em out.

You'll eventually run into a hospital that will

1) refuse to answer if it is covered by insurance because they have so many providers they won't know.

2) a "3rd party" like a MRI tech that is not in network

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#122

Post by crazygringo »

wolverine876 wrote: post #112
crazygringo wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you aren't doing anything about it, the problem is you. What do you expect me to do about it? I live in a reliably blue area and it's Republicans who are blocking things like a single-payer system. So what exactly are you suggesting? Uproot my life and go move to a swing state so I can vote Democrat there? Because short of that, I don't know what. And the country is so culturally divided, it's not like there are…

You're right. You're helpless. Is that what you want to hear? Is that what you say at work? Is that what you tell your kids when they have a problem? Take step back - this response is beneath us; it's making ourselves victims. I could spell it out concretely, but the problem is the approach, the attitude, that talking like helpless victims is somehow ok. It's completely irresponsible - an abdication of our responsibi…

> I could spell it out concretely

Well please do then.

There are lots of people with drive on the Democrat side -- look at everything Bernie inspired, for example. There's ideas and drive aplenty. Look at the optimism that propelled Obama into office. And then look at how little he was able to accomplish, compared with what he hoped to. Look at how he discovered that Republicans wouldn't work with him, no matter how bipartisan he tried to be.

Because Republicans have drive too, in service of their own ideas -- ideas which are diametrically opposed to all of that. And they have the votes to block anything meaningful.

So again, please spell it out concretely. How do you propose to overcome the power that Republicans currently wield? I'd love to hear your thoughts spelled out -- your effective political strategy here to get the votes.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#123

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

ahi wrote: post #31
taeric wrote: post #7

That has included me, in the past. It is stupid easy to accidentally have a debt to a hospital. For families, sensible privacy rules at clinics can mean that it is very hard to choke point bills to a single person. To the point that I asked every time if I owed money when I did checkups to be told that we did not. Only to later find that my family did, in fact, have a bill due. For a while. Recently I'm getting it wi…

I've been getting those separate bills recently and it's driving me nuts. For one small out patient procedure I have received bills from the hospital, the doctor, the anesthesiologist, anesthesiologist nursing company, and a random surgeon I have never met that the doctor asked in for a 30 second consult (I know how long the procedure took) while I was under. Seriously considering ignoring some of these whotf-are-you…

there is a company where you can submit your bills if you suspect overbilling. they have professional coders on staff and they will find fraud or overbilling on your behalf and also sue the hospital too

medical billing fraud is a serious offense that can get the hospital in quitw hot water and they leverage that

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#124

Post by theonething »

taeric wrote: post #7

That has included me, in the past. It is stupid easy to accidentally have a debt to a hospital. For families, sensible privacy rules at clinics can mean that it is very hard to choke point bills to a single person. To the point that I asked every time if I owed money when I did checkups to be told that we did not. Only to later find that my family did, in fact, have a bill due. For a while. Recently I'm getting it wi…

I like Kaiser in that sense. None of this separate bills monkey business. In fact, for my plan, no bills at all. Just upfront co-pays and then you're done paying.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#125

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

wing-_-nuts wrote: post #45
taeric wrote: post #7

That has included me, in the past. It is stupid easy to accidentally have a debt to a hospital. For families, sensible privacy rules at clinics can mean that it is very hard to choke point bills to a single person. To the point that I asked every time if I owed money when I did checkups to be told that we did not. Only to later find that my family did, in fact, have a bill due. For a while. Recently I'm getting it wi…

One thing my mom has been dealing with recently is where the insurance EOB and the bill differs substantially. My mom called the hospital to ask for an explanation and poof the bill is magically lowered by a several hundred dollars. How the heck is this not criminal fraud? Why are people allowed to simply bill whatever they feel like it, and why is my mother getting 'balance billed' for random amounts? They're still…

its not nefarious - most likely the patient statement printed and sent before someone corrected the coordination of benefits (i.e. right insurance, right copay etc), usually triggered by you.

So you got a paper that was outdated, that's it.

Its actually typical for a patient to have a huge balance, then get sent the amount, so the patient has ownership of the problem. That usually results in patients calling and correcting whatever error they (or staff) made that made balances ballon.

Unfortunately, as long as everything including a paper cut is supposed to be covered by a regulated health plan, that's what we are going to get.

All you can eat tends to increase the cost to provide it, if someone else is paying for it.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#126

Post by giantg2 »

lazide wrote: post #113
giantg2 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... US government-run "socialism". Because we all know how well they run all the other programs, especially if you've dealt with healthcare they already run (military and VA). I'd imagine people would be clamoring for socialized medicine if they fixed the VA to be a shining example.

The VA may suck. But compared to 90% of private insurance, it’s amazing.

That has not be the experiences I've heard of from just about anyone who has had both.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#127

Post by smileysteve »

petre wrote: post #35
devilbunny wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because historically doctors were in private practices. I still am, as an anesthesiologist. Many of the surgeons I work with are also private. So, since neither of us is employed by the hospital, we do our own billing. If we were hospital employees, we could indeed do unified billing. That's a better analogy; your chefs are expecting to be paid by the restaurant, so it collects the bill. I am not paid by the hospital…

It's still better than billing to the hospital and the hospital billing to the patient, piling up taxes and comissions. The patient is also getting more cost transparency instead of a bundled bill one can never make sense of.

Disagree.

To follow the restaurant example above.

And since the topic is debt, how do you think that affects the small private practice? The hospital, that has scheduled and contracted the doctor, on site, with the hospitals equipment is more able to have a loss column than an individual.

This seems like something the IRS should fix; as all of the above makes the contractor an employee of the hospital.

Can you imagine flying on a Delta flight and you have to pay a separate bill to a 3rd party maintenance company.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#128

Post by kazizi »

Buttons840 wrote: post #77
ahi wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been getting those separate bills recently and it's driving me nuts. For one small out patient procedure I have received bills from the hospital, the doctor, the anesthesiologist, anesthesiologist nursing company, and a random surgeon I have never met that the doctor asked in for a 30 second consult (I know how long the procedure took) while I was under. Seriously considering ignoring some of these whotf-are-you…

I'm surprised medical billing scams aren't rampant, considering it's 100% normal to have a bill from from an unknown company show up asking for payment for unclear reasons for a procedure done a year ago.

They are rampant though. Been in the medical system for the better part of a decade and after every hospital visit, I have to call the hospital to verify each bill I receive. At least 20% of the bills mailed to me are fake.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#129

Post by Aloisius »

slfnflctd wrote: post #68
alwa wrote: post #39

Buried midway down, they mention that the commercial health plans available to people without conventional employers (Obamacare) can (and routinely do) set deductibles as high as $9,450. And that’s in addition to the premium-which, in New York City for example, starts at $618/month for the very worst plan for an individual. Sure, that’s subsidized for lower-income households — but who among those has a spare $10K lyi…

We should've gotten single payer. The insurance lobby is just too strong, I guess. In several recent years, I would've been better off not having insurance and paying out of pocket because I never (or just barely) hit the deductible. Even when my deductible was lower, if you added up my premiums against what was covered I still probably overpaid most years. So all I've been doing is subsidizing someone else's bills w…

Single payer was killed by the healthcare provider lobbies, not the insurance lobby.

Doctors have waged a war against single payer anytime it has been suggested for over a century. The power the doctor and the hospital lobbies wield to sway opinion utterly dwarfs that of the health insurance industry.

Re: Majority of debtors to US hospitals now people with health insurance

#130

Post by giantg2 »

paxys wrote: post #97
giantg2 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... US government-run "socialism". Because we all know how well they run all the other programs, especially if you've dealt with healthcare they already run (military and VA). I'd imagine people would be clamoring for socialized medicine if they fixed the VA to be a shining example.

And yet Medicare has a 94% satisfaction rate.

Sure, once they pay their tax for decades, pay their premiums and copay, and buy their supplimental private insurance (not to mention facilities diffusing some costs through higher price setting of private parties). It's not a bad system, but you can't really scale a system that takes decades to fund and requires all these other costs. Especially since this conversation is about debt to medical facilities which can still occur under Medicare (or be forced onto Medicaid). Yes, supposedly it would save the US $2 trillion over 10 years, although there is some debate on that.

Edit: why disagree?

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