Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

phys.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 215 posts

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#121

Post by whartung »

neonnoodle wrote: post #89

I started casually watching the reality TV series "Deadliest Catch" about 15 years ago, and became a regular viewer since then. In that time span: - the amount of Bering Sea ice has dropped significantly - the amount of 100-year storms has increased - crab numbers have decreased - crab seasons have been outright canceled due to major population collapses - crab that remain are seeking deeper/colder water As much diss…

People negatively affect by regulation complain about regulation. Say it ain't so!

Any regulation of this type has a pointy end poking into someones back, regardless of the overall goal or intent of the regulation. Doesn't mean the regulation is bad, simply that it impacts someone.

While climate change is certainly having an impact on the crab fisheries in Alaska, none of the population changes have been attributed to over fishing. While, like everyone, the fleet contributes to systemic climate change, it's certainly not "their fault". They're just another microcosm showing impact of the climate dynamic. The Alaska fisheries are some of the best managed fisheries in the world, and the fishermen comply and work with the regulations.

The change to a quota system over the free-for-all derby system impacted a lot of fishermen. No doubt those whose livelihood were disrupted probably have a low opinion of it. The survivors probably enjoy it more, as its a more deterministic and safer system without the racing aspects of derby fishing, and the fishery is better managed because of it.

Arguably an overall win. But not for those who dropped off the bottom, they were forced to find something else.

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#122

Post by tw04 »

vkou wrote: post #91
tw04 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That is something that can be done at a local level without global cooperation. You're assuming some foreign operator won't come to your local waters to illegally fish. China has shown they will fish literally anywhere they can get away with it. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/09/26/world/asia/ch...

It's worth noting that Korea and Taiwan are right behind China in illegal fishing (#3 and #6, respectively). For reasons , it doesn't win you any friends when you complain about them, though.

>It's worth noting that Korea and Taiwan are right behind China in illegal fishing (#3 and #6, respectively).

You should really include a citation when you claim countries are "on a list". For all I know they are #3 and #6 on "vkou's list of least favorite countries".

Korea doesn't appear on the NOAA's list at all for 2023. Taiwan's impact is a tiny fraction of China's. While that's still not OK, we're comparing apples and atomic bombs.

>Angola, Grenada, Mexico, the People’s Republic of China (PRC), Taiwan, The Gambia, and Vanuatu were identified for reported or alleged IUU fishing that occurred between 2020 and 2022. PRC and Taiwan’s identifications include information related to seafood-related goods produced through forced labor.

https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/s3/2023-08/2023.ReportSummary...

https://www.fisheries.noaa.gov/s3/2023-08/2023RTC-ImprovingI...

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#124

Post by whartung »

riffraff wrote: post #108
neonnoodle wrote: post #89

I started casually watching the reality TV series "Deadliest Catch" about 15 years ago, and became a regular viewer since then. In that time span: - the amount of Bering Sea ice has dropped significantly - the amount of 100-year storms has increased - crab numbers have decreased - crab seasons have been outright canceled due to major population collapses - crab that remain are seeking deeper/colder water As much diss…

interestingly, blue crab from the US atlantic coast is now an invasive species in the mediterranean.

We should ship over a few large containers of "Old Bay", perhaps that will help fix that problem over there. Blue crab are, indeed, "Good eats".

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#125

Post by verisimi »

alwa wrote: post #73
verisimi wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you give an example of a 'meat subsidy'? I'm unaware of any.

It’s been a while since I brushed up on that question, thank you for the impetus! The EWG attempts to enumerate the federal subsidies, which, by its count, total some $50bn directly to livestock producers since 1995, plus $160bn to farms that produce mainly feedstock for the meat. [0] To be fair, EWG’s count includes disaster assistance, COVID subsidies, and direct compensation for losses related to Trump’s trade war…

Fair enough... but its not like these numbers are actually that clear.

The EWG say:

> The Department of Agriculture has spent almost $50 billion in subsidies for livestock operators since 1995, according to an EWG analysis.

Analysis is akin to interpretation... and we can read that their mission is an environmental one:

> Since 1993, the Environmental Working Group has shined a spotlight on outdated legislation, harmful agricultural practices and industry loopholes that pose a risk to our health and the health of our environment.

So their analysis would say livestock is over-subsidised, as that is aligned their mission. It doesn't mean that my analysis would be in agreement with theirs.

I also looked at one of pdfs they link to:

https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/AMS%20Pur...

I would need to go through all these numbers, check the sources, check how each was subsidised, work out what counts as "livestock" - eg is butter purchasing livestock, is bison, is farmed fish, etc. A long boring thankless task.

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#126

Post by strangattractor »

pphysch wrote: post #102
tw04 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>That is something that can be done at a local level without global cooperation. You're assuming some foreign operator won't come to your local waters to illegally fish. China has shown they will fish literally anywhere they can get away with it. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/09/26/world/asia/ch...

I know China-bashing is popular on this website, but a quite search of market data reveals that China isn't even in the top 10 of tuna producers NOR consumers. Basic economics would suggest that a country with low nominal GDP/capita would not be the final destination for a global commodity (with relatively high production cost) like deep sea fish. Given that your production site is in the Pacific Ocean, why would you…

Maybe their population size explains a difference. Say 10% of a billion people can afford expensive fish - 100 million people. 1/3 the population of the US. One might also notice the preponderance of Chinese fishing vessels in areas far from China. [1] And just maybe those vessel are not properly identifying themselves so the true numbers are unknown. [2]

Just maybe the fishing grounds close to Chine are all fished out.

[1] https://dialogo-americas.com/articles/chilean-navy-increases...

[2] https://globalfishingwatch.org/data/analysis-reveals-false-v...

Re: Tuna species popular in sashimi and poke bowls in sharp decline

#130

Post by strangattractor »

yongjik wrote: post #117
rolobio wrote: post #12

I watched a documentary years ago about jellyfish invading Japan. Basically, the jellyfish population was exploding because the fish didn't exist to eat the baby jellyfish and keep them under control. The Japanese fishermen were furious that they kept catching jellyfish, rather than the fish that they wanted. They were the cause of their own suffering. Sounds like things haven't changed... I hesitate to think that Ja…

> If they stopped over-fishing, that would just attract Chinese fishermen who would fill the gaps. Maybe that's true, but isn't this the exact same argument used by Americans: "Why should I stop driving my SUV, when China will burn that gas anyway?"

False Equivalence

When the gas is gone those SUVs will simply stop working. When the fish are gone large populations of people will not have sufficient food to eat.

Post reply on HN