Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous • Hacker News Board

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#121

Post by theossuary » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:05 PM UTC

bigyikes wrote: post #99

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

>They didn't drink or do drugs or consider themselves victims, and it didn't help one bit. Are you saying that your family would have been the same had your parents done drugs or considered themselves victims? If so, why do you think that? Seems like a very bold claim. If not, what are you actually saying?

I think the end point is that if more people were able to admit when they're a victim, instead of being shamed for it; then change could occur.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#122

Post by KennyBlanken » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:05 PM UTC

dustincoates wrote: post #46

wackycat wrote: post #33

Isn't he the guy that tried to build windowless dorms? Anyone who thinks humans should live without natural light is not anyone I am interested in taking advice from. Ref: https://www.archpaper.com/2023/08/university-california-aban...

> While the dorm rooms themselves don’t have windows, the exterior of the building does, which lets natural light into the communal living spaces. The reasoning was too encourage people to hang out in common areas to create more of a community feeling. Whether you think that's necessary or a good idea (I went to college long ago, but there wasn't any need to have architecture diving our community), it's not the same…

"There are no windows except in common areas, thus it's not a dorm without windows" is such a strange hill to try and die on.

> I went to college long ago, but there wasn't any need to have architecture diving our community

Ah, that explains it.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#123

Post by mmaunder » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:05 PM UTC

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

Until you’ve actually failed hard for a very long time - over a decade - and then get a solid kick in the teeth for your efforts, and power through that shit with an optimistic attitude to succeed beyond your own expectations, it’s hard to buy into what Charlie is saying, but I can assure you it’s the absolute truth. You can’t change the hand your dealt or what life continues to deal you, but you can keep working smart and hard to solve it and that’s going to give you a pretty damn good shot.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#124

Post by atleastoptimal » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:05 PM UTC

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

The "avoid thinking like you're a victim" is a tool to help motivation and attitude but not sufficient for success. You have to be smart enough to know the meta-model of inputs and outputs in the world to maximize your chance of ending up where you want to be.

You could work as hard as possible flipping burgers, it won't make you a billionaire, and even a very dumb person could see that.

You have to merely understand the paths people take in life that lead to where you want to be, evaluate the stochastic horizons, and act in accordance to your best bet on what would work. Whether or not, in this process, you consider yourself the ultimate master of your circumstances or a helpless victim flailing at the machinery of a cruel system makes no difference. All that matters is what affects how you think and what you do, and all the feedback loops therein.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#125

Post by sethammons » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:06 PM UTC

bmitc wrote: post #13

bloodyplonker22 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's easy to make a pithy observation that he's a billionaire and then proceed to spew hate while thinking everything is a zero sum game. When Charlie was in his 30s, he was broke, his 9 year old son died, and he had a divorce. He was never a victim that blames others for their misfortunes though.

So it's his fault that all that happened to him? I am sorry that someone has died, and I regret making a comment on this particular post before realizing the actual post topic too late, but I am not too keen on living my life based upon how billionaires think. Munger, like many billionaires and as the above quote and his dorm designs showcase, liked to speak about things he didn't know anything about, and people like…

self-blame is not the same as taking responsibility. Only one person can change you: you. Taking responsibility for yourself is the only way I know how that works.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#126

Post by 1oooqooq » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:06 PM UTC

debacle wrote: post #117

m463 wrote: post #42

I don't understand the last story about the banking and the mortgages. did she take the mortgages out of the son's bank or put them in or ... ?

The bank was insolvent because of bad debts, so the grandfather put the bad debts on his books and some of his good debts on the bank's books so that the bank was solvent.

> poor grandfather

> only judge in a town

> enough money to send all nephews to college

> enough money to literary "save the bank" with nothing but his amateur money lending hobby

checks out the background of everyone who tells others to just "pick themselves up by their bootstraps". Rest in peace.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#127

Post by GreedClarifies » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:06 PM UTC

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

I think he lived his own advice.

"At 31 years old, Charlie Munger was divorced, broke, and burying his 9 year old son, who had died from cancer"

But he persevered to become one of the most successful people on the planet.

No doubt he was a brilliant human and that helped tremendously, but he didn't think of himself as a victim.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#128

Post by IKantRead » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:06 PM UTC

bigyikes wrote: post #99

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

>They didn't drink or do drugs or consider themselves victims, and it didn't help one bit. Are you saying that your family would have been the same had your parents done drugs or considered themselves victims? If so, why do you think that? Seems like a very bold claim. If not, what are you actually saying?

I think they're saying the interaction effect of doing drugs, drinking and considering oneself a victim is negligible on overall success.

It doesn't seem like a bold claim to me. I've known plenty of poor, struggling working class people. The only impact drinking or claiming they're a victim have is influencing how much fun they have at parties.

I've happen to know plenty of wildly successful people who also drink and/or think they're victims. Again, primary effect I've noticed seems to be how much fun they are at parties.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#129

Post by decafninja » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:07 PM UTC

bmitc wrote: post #15

homefree wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 these looked great, I would have much rather lived in this than the triple with zero privacy I lived in during school.

I lived in my own room with a shared living room in a dorm room decades ago. And it had a window and opened to the outside. The point is that better designs exist, but people will defend Munger just because his design could be worse . I think my opinion and reaction is based upon his reaction. He rejected all criticism outright and refused to listen to anyone. It was his design, or he would take his money away.

Better designs exist, but they are rare, often due to circumstances like costs.

I too would have welcomed a private windowless dorm room versus having a forced roommate with no privacy. I specifically chose to commute an hour+ from my parents home because I couldn’t stand the lack of privacy offered by any of my school’s dorm options.

Re: Charlie Munger – Feeling Like a Victim Is Perfectly Disastrous

#130

Post by codegeek » Tue, Nov 28, 2023, 10:08 PM UTC

ihumanable wrote: post #83

Somewhat the height of survivorship bias. There are a many number of people that don't adopt a victim mentality, work hard, and try to get ahead and just don't. For every Charlie Munger there are tons of working poor that get up everyday, work hard for minimum wage, then go off to their second job. My entire childhood I watched both my parents, who both had 2 jobs, work themselves non-stop to try to provide for us. T…

You are missing the point. It is not about misfortune. Yes there are millions of people like your parents who worked hard and struggled to provide. But did they choose to be victims ? No. You can have misfortune and still choose not be a victim and blame others. Also, turns out that they did a decent job raising you where you are able to be a software engineer (from your HN profile). So I would say they won. Wouldn't you ?