Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

I’m ready to trade in my electric car

latimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 339 posts

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#121

Post by mkozlows »

In 1997, I bought a DVD player, and didn't have a VCR.

You couldn't rent DVDs at Blockbuster, or indeed anywhere. Most movies weren't available on DVD, so you could watch only the few that had made it to the format (and had to purchase them for full price, at that). Being a DVD-only owner was limiting and annoying in a bunch of ways, even though the DVD experience was a lot better than the VCR experience.

If in 1997, I had written a blog post about how having just a DVD player kinda sucks, and I want to have a "hybrid" VCR + DVD experience, it wouldn't have been a super hot take -- but at the same time, it would have also been clear that I wasn't saying there's any big problem with DVDs, I was just having normal early adopter problems, and pretty soon they'd all be solved. (By 1999, Blockbuster offered hundreds of DVDs for rental, pretty soon studios were cranking out their entire catalogs on DVD, and not long after that Netflix broke big.)

And... that's about where we are with EVs. If you have an EV today, you're an early adopter, and you're going to suffer early adopter pains. In 2-3 years, things'll be better. In five years, they'll be better yet. At some point, EVs will be so normal that only a few EV OGs will be like "man, remember when it was a whole big thing to find a working charger? Haha, wow, that sucked back then."

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#122

Post by d_burfoot »

How about we just give up the very American concept of “road trip”? It’s bad for the environment, bad for your health, dangerous, and increases the burden on the already overloaded highway system. If you want to visit somewhere farther than your EV can take you, ride a bus, plane, or train. When you arrive, try walking, biking or ride-sharing apps to get around.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#123

Post by Marsymars »

Zanni wrote: post #9

Or ... trade it in for a better EV (i.e. a Tesla). The Supercharger network is much denser and more reliable than the patchwork of non-Tesla chargers. My anecdotal experience matches the author's of roughly a quarter of all public (non-Tesla) charging stations simply not working.

I don’t think I could, in good faith, buy a Tesla product or service as long as Musk has an ownership stake.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#124

Post by aksss »

cronix wrote: post #68
aksss wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know that it’s wildly impractical. Some people carry battery-powered emergency jump starters for their ICE car. This just seems like the reciprocal backup power solution. Carrying a generator seems very practical to me if you are putting yourself in situations where it could be not just useful but the difference between you being stranded vs self-sufficient. Nobody said that owning an electric vehicle require…

Maybe conceptually they're kind of the same, but not practically. Something that fits in your hand is different than something that fits in your trunk.

Yes, they are conceptually the same - backup power source to get you out of a situation that would otherwise leave you stranded.

Practically? Generators come in pretty small packages these days. They'll fit on the floorboard of your back seat (or in the back seat), or easily in the trunk just like another piece of luggage.

I mean all of this assumes a particular context - the steps you take to be prepared for risks that are medium probability and high impact are not the same steps necessary when, on a daily basis, those same risks drop to a very low probability and low to medium impact.

If it's the choice between being the guy who, after miles on the road, arrives in a storm-stricken town as GP related with his EV near dead and the townsfolk gathering around to point and laugh at a stereotype of luxurious thinking, or being someone with an inefficient yet practical solution to the lack of chargers, I'd take the latter.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#125

Post by borski »

aik wrote: post #62
borski wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The implication that Teslas were somehow superior and outside the category of other EVs. I don’t hate Teslas; I just consider them another EV, with some pros (the supercharger network) and some cons. Elon and the FSD nonsense is one such con. I only brought it up because he just promised it again by the end of this year, and it set off a spate of people going “Tesla is the best” when we’ve all seen this story before.…

Are you arguing that FSD will never come? Or just that it will likely be delayed again? Or that they’re not even working on it? If you’ve seen any of their AI presentations in recent years, I’m a little confused by your comment. I know some of it is marketing but it is incredibly impressive what they’re building. I would be surprised if anyone else is even close to how advanced they are. I just think the problem, the…

I’m arguing that Tesla is no longer the obvious leader in EVs. That’s all.

FSD may or may not come eventually. I’m doubtful. But as it stands, other makers are improving rapidly and Tesla has produced little innovation to compete with them in recent years, instead choosing to focus on touting features that seldom come (2016 was the first year FSD was coming “by the end of the year”) and cost-cutting measure to improve profits at the cost of customer experience.

That’s not a jab on Tesla as a company as much as it is just disappointment. Their lead is dwindling, and I wish they’d focus on innovating instead of whatever else is happening right now.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#126

Post by linguae »

weebull wrote: post #85
linguae wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. I ultimately ended up purchasing a Toyota Mirai (a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle) for this reason; my apartment has no charging units and my landlord has no plans to install them. There is public charging about an eight minute walk away from me, however, which I did consider when evaluating my car purchase options last summer.

You were worried about electric charging infrastructure, and so bought a hydrogen car instead. I'm speechless.

It’s actually working out; my job is located near hydrogen fuel stations, and while there were hiccups with the supply back in December and January, I’ve had no problems refueling my car since. Refueling takes about five minutes, compared to 30 minutes when using a fast charger with a battery-backed EV. Another thing that helps is Toyota has been subsidizing fuel costs for purchasers of new and certified used Mirais; I have a $15,000 fuel card valid for up to six years after purchase, though I anticipate the card running out of money well before then unless hydrogen prices drop substantially.

Yes, long-distance drives that are outside the limited refueling network are out of the question, but Toyota provides 21 days of complimentary car rentals for owners of new Mirai models.

So far I enjoy my Mirai. While I wish hydrogen prices were cheaper (prices went from a maximum of $19.70/kg in November to $26.75/kg in January and have remained at that level since), the Mirai is the best car I’ve driven in terms of its drive feel, comfort, and technology; it’s a dramatic upgrade from the Toyota Prius c I used to own, and I even prefer it to the Subaru BRZ I had years ago.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#127

Post by kbos87 »

avalys wrote: post #96

Yes, electric cars are not viable unless you can charge at home. Meaning, in your garage / driveway. This means they're not that useful for people who live in apartments, and most people who live in a city like SF and park on the street(*). They're also not viable for road trips. Teslas can make it work but you still have to be willing for your trip to take 20 - 30% longer than it would with a gas car. For people who…

I have a Tesla, no home charging, and I can't underscore how much of a non-issue it is. I charge once or twice a week at a shopping plaza I'd be visiting anyway.

When I roadtrip (I regularly do 150-250 mile road trips around New England), I'm usually stopping at a supercharger within a mile of the highway at a location equivalent to one I would have stopped anyway. Most times I only need to charge for 20 minutes to finish my trip with plenty of range to spare. I would have stopped at some point anyway so it's adding 5-15 minutes max on a 3 hour trip.

Obviously location and situation dependent, but for me it couldn't be any less of an issue.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#128

Post by borski »

iknowstuff wrote: post #65
borski wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve had zero issues charging either my Lucid Air or my Ioniq 5.

Happy for you, but your experience is not the norm. https://twitter.com/RateYourCharge

That is not necessarily true. The outliers are widely reported, because successful experiences do not generally cause people to post online about how great their experience was.

You’re going to hear about the negative experiences because that is what people commiserate about. It’s human nature.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#129

Post by jandrewrogers »

d_burfoot wrote: post #122

How about we just give up the very American concept of “road trip”? It’s bad for the environment, bad for your health, dangerous, and increases the burden on the already overloaded highway system. If you want to visit somewhere farther than your EV can take you, ride a bus, plane, or train. When you arrive, try walking, biking or ride-sharing apps to get around.

> If you want to visit somewhere farther than your EV can take you, ride a bus, plane, or train. When you arrive, try walking, biking or ride-sharing apps to get around.

You must have missed the part where a great many places in the US are not accessible this way. People often go on road trips because it is the only way to travel. This is especially true if you like to spend time in the great outdoors that is the western US. Some of these highways don't even have cellular service.

Re: I’m ready to trade in my electric car

#130

Post by freetime2 »

ShakataGaNai wrote: post #33

The problem here is one of someone not doing their research, electric charging challenges, and apparently not knowing how maps work. Is CCS charging unreliable today? Yes, compared to gas station or Tesla Super Chargers... CCS has a ways to go. They are the weak link. The author doesn't discuss ANYTHING positive, like how its super easy to have a fully charged vehicle all the time because you charge at home overnight…

> The author doesn't discuss ANYTHING positive

The article begins with:

> I love how I never have to buy gas. I love how it glides quietly up the street. I love that it has so much pickup that I can easily blow past gas-powered muscle cars if I want to. I love having stickers that allow me to drive solo in the HOV lanes. I love that routine maintenance consists of little more than rotating the tires.

The author states repeatedly that they love their EV, but the inconvenience/uncertainty around charging on longer road trips is enough to be a deal breaker for them.

> And yes, if you a doing a lot of long road trips… then please stick with ICE for now.

I feel like the tone of your comment is overly dismissive of the author’s complaints, considering that you essentially end up agreeing with them at the end.

Post reply on HN