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Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

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Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#121

Post by kosievdmerwe »

BurningFrog wrote: post #72
morkalork wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading about what the Soviet Union did in countries like Estonia and Ukraine is pretty harrowing stuff. Wanting to join NATO for protection after is completely understandable and denying them because it would upset their former (and present) abuser is a shameful thought.

Very true. Though it's good to remember the Soviet Union did even worse things to Russia.

The problem is that as far as I understand Russia claims to be the successor state of the USSR, meaning they want to claim all its glories (and crimes)

Which if true, means that Russian civilian victimization by the Soviet Union is something to hold Russia accountable for rather than a point of mutual past victimization for past Soviet Union states to commiserate together with Russia on.

That's never mind the fact that Russia is committing some of those same crimes now along with waging an expansionist war. The past suffering of an abuser doesn't matter while he's actively abusing someone else.

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#122

Post by mrcheesebreeze »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #76
ElectricalUnion wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the BRICS surpassed the G7 in terms of GDP and more countries are seeking to join. Is "the BRICS" something besides a joint meeting that happens every now and then? What's the point in joining a joint meeting that happens every now and then?

Isn't that what the G7 is? The G7 isn't very important, neither is BRICS. There's just a lot of Americans that want to see America fail because other people have different views than them.

Its not that, its more the general feeling of an american decline and an obsession on knowing how it will end.

Doomer feelings are growing more prevalent as out population becomes more divided and our monetary situation grows worse.

Many americans feel that our "American Empire" that dominated world politics is losing ground fast and there is a need to cope by being "smart" and swearing you know how it will happen.

Its pure copium, but it feels good to cope and feel an illusion of control.

TL;DR: its a need for control in worsening times, not hatred, that drives the doomer theories of an American collapse.

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#123

Post by coffeebeqn »

ethanbond wrote: post #12
motohagiography wrote: post #6

[flagged]

On what planet does a country have a say over the territories that used to be part of the same defunct empire it was part of?

I’m sure the parent comment is also very worried that the UK doesn’t have enough say in India anymore

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#124

Post by alkonaut »

xkcd1963 wrote: post #101
The_Colonel wrote: post #4

Finland got de-Finlandized at last. Which is what the expansion of NATO was always about. NATO isn't a threat to Russia itself - if Russia seriously feared NATO aggression, it wouldn't voluntarily demilitarize its NATO borders during the past 13 months. NATO expansion just neutralizes Russian ability to force its will upon its neighbors through threat of aggression (or in case like Ukraine through the use of aggressi…

[flagged]

I know this is the worst kind of whataboutism and shouldn't be awarded a response but I'll bite.

Finland joining means it becomes part of a defense pact. It's not like suddenly the "US sphere of influence" expands, or that there are somehow US military bases in Eastern Finland.

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#126

Post by realworldperson »

foverzar wrote: post #67
GalenErso wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If his former exes asked for a restraining order against him, what incentive or assurance does he have for allowing them to break up with him?" The problem is Russia. Russia could be a normal country like its neighbors and make money from trading goods while wooing foreign investors, but Putin took the history books he read too seriously and thinks he can pull another round of territorial conquests. I don't see how…

> The problem is Russia. Russia could be a normal country like its neighbors and make money from trading goods > No one is encroaching on Russia's borders. This is really horrifying how the perspectives on the current directly oppose each other, completely Orwellian. It's not like it's some ancient history, all of this is following the lessons learned from interactions in the 2000s - when the US had been violating th…

[dead]

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#127

Post by UncleEntity »

rainworld wrote: post #102
khochesh_kushat wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is what all the smart people said about Ukraine prior to the invasion, that it was impossible and would never happen.

[flagged]

> … and Western support turned his last-minute coercive expedition into full-blown war.

His what?

Massing a hundred thousand troops on the border isn’t “last minute” and they had their sights set on a (quick) regime change after a shock and awe campaign to force surrender.

Do you want an apology or something?

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#128

Post by rainworld »

coffeebeqn wrote: post #111
rainworld wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

The Finnish people seem to disagree with your assessment. This was not a decision made on a whim

Which is irrelevant to what I wrote. And the decision wasn’t made on a whim, it was made because the opportunity had arisen. Popular support was secondary. Not like they held a plebiscite or called an election over the matter.

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#129

Post by ghiculescu »

The comments are pretty hard to read here given that any comment not cheering this on is immediately downvoted to death. Many are legitimate comments - I see why some might disagree with them but it’s not even possible to learn from them if they are silenced.

Re: Finland becomes the 31st member of NATO

#130

Post by tekla »

polski-g wrote: post #64
mcphage wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Russia could also take over all of Ukraine in about a week. I think that qualifies for a great big [Citation Needed].

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsar_Bomba

You understand Russia doesn't have these bombs because it was judged to be impractical?
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