Why would you want Microsoft to trust Microsoft? Good on them for not trusting themselves, makes a secure baseline
Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
121–130 of 140 posts
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yep, my first reaction was, "seems to work as designed". The fix isn't to whitelist, the fix is to make their own emails more relevant (or easier to unsubscribe from).
I’ve known people who use the spam button for any email they do’t want right now. They say “it’s easier” than hitting the “unsbuscribe” link or they say “if I hit unsubscribe they’ll just send me more email”. It’s hard to maintain a rational filtering system under those circumstances.
I've seen faked brand emails hit my Gmail inbox with (presumably malicious) unsubscribe links, and I've definitely seen sites "forget" that I've unsubscribed.
It's a bit of a tragedy of the commons, but I think the state of email is such that simply reporting unwanted email as spam is a rational choice
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#123Were the emails junk though? You didn't mention if they were emails you wanted or not?
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#124Microsoft's disjointed approach to email doesn't surprise me here. They're actively enabling more phishing and fraud by not respecting the DMARC standard or participating in sending aggregate reports. For all that people like to bag on Google recently, Google has worked harder than anybody on this.
> For all that people like to bag on Google recently, Google has worked harder than anybody on this. Oh come on. Back when they first built Gmail, maybe sure. But in the last 10 years or so? They’ve been totally ignoring the fact that they categorize their own non-marketing non-spammy emails, specifically requested on specific non-spammy topics by the user, generated by Google, and sent by Google, as spam. I don’t th…
For advancement and adoption of standards to help combat this stuff, yes they have indeed. Yahoo as well.
Most other companies seem interested in selling band-aids to repeated cuts than preventing the cuts in the first place.
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
> For all that people like to bag on Google recently, Google has worked harder than anybody on this. Oh come on. Back when they first built Gmail, maybe sure. But in the last 10 years or so? They’ve been totally ignoring the fact that they categorize their own non-marketing non-spammy emails, specifically requested on specific non-spammy topics by the user, generated by Google, and sent by Google, as spam. I don’t th…
For advancement and adoption of standards to help combat this stuff, yes they have indeed. Yahoo as well. Most other companies seem interested in selling band-aids to repeated cuts than preventing the cuts in the first place.
But there are still no truly widely used standards to ensure emails are actually from the claimed sender. Many of the most popular phone-based email apps (including Google's) don't even show the from/reply-to addresses by default, and often make it hard to determine what URLs embedded links refer to.
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
I would love for society to return to using "virtue-signaling" and "vice-signaling" in their original meaning, instead of this contemporary linguistic hell where the former is a derogatory synonym for political correctness.
since in contemporary western society we don't have commonly agreed-upon ideas of "good", "good" becomes an individualized, emotionally-driven thing about agreeability. in the absence of a standard, "the virtues" are replaced with the much more malleable concept of singular "virtue". so today "virtuous" just means "good" and "good" means "agreeable to my worldview", and since we've collectively conflated worldview wi…
In order to smash the patriarchy completely, we'll need to abolish the term "virtuous" because it literally means "manly".
So, even a "virtuous woman" possesses "manly" good qualities. Repugnant, isn't it?
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
VS Code's selling point is that it's a middle-ground between (relatively) lightweight performance of a text editor, and power of an IDE. People are keeping an eye on performance, and they'll stop using it if it just becomes a bloated, master-of-none IDE. Teams' bread and butter is being "good enough" for enterprise. And they're also locked into a lot of bad early decisions they made since they don't want to break com…
What do people not like about Teams? I just started using it with a contract customer and it seems fine. Does what it says on the proverbial tin.
Teams, unlike pretty much every competing solution, is horrible when working with multiple different identities. If you have an account with an employer, a university and multiple clients, switching them is a pain (compare and contrast, for example, Slack). If you want to get a meeting in your Teams organization and invite a few people who are currently logged in their own organization, it is a pain to do so, and may involve them signing off of all kinds of other key MS tools they need to use during the meeting. If you want to use your phone to be in 'chats' of three different Teams organizations (e.g. three different consulting customers) at the same time, without switching between them but just monitoring all of them at the same time, I'm not sure if it can be reasonably done, and that IMHO is a relatively simple need and one which everyone else somehow manages to do better.
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#128Month or two ago I was getting a lot of spam from Microsoft domains, good to know that they finally caught up and solved the issue. In a special, Microsoft way.
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
Being this obnoxious won't help the cause at all. Keep using this alternative yourself when you can. Perhaps it will naturally fade out of use. For instance, you could have commented about it using "allowlist" in your own writing and it would be just natural. Personally I'd say we have a limited bandwith to talk about prejudice in the public discourse. I'd rather we don't waste it away with useless remarks.
> Being this obnoxious The comment contained a grand total of three words. If someone has this initial reaction to those words in this context, perhaps they should consider their priors.
You see, that's a problem. I'm left-wing. I'm part of minorities. I won't give up my political convictions and side with reactiona... I mean, conservatives because I'm annoyed by this focus on the raw words and not on intention.
Yet, just remarking this is enough for insinuations like yours.
Re: Tell HN: Microsoft classifies own emails as junk
#130They've been sending me emails in some nordic language for years unprompted by me.