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Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

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Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#121
post #48

A bit more context: * Wizards of the Coast (WoTC) has been tasked by Hasbro (which owns WoTC) to drastically increase profits over a few years. * WoTC has been aggressively increasing prices on Magic the Gathering (MTG) and drastically increased the diversity of products. This overwhelmed even people who follow and produce MTG news. Wallet fatique is rampant and people are disgruntled. * WoTC releases the 30th aniver…

> The real problem is the managers at WoTC that don't really care about the games. They only care about money. I expect more bad things in the future. The same seems to be true with Games Workshop and I've never understood this. The products from both companies have huge markups (painted cards and pieces of plastic) and I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale…

> I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale rather than treating their products as luxury items

I'm not sure that's true. The actual bottleneck with these games is not money but time and interest: you have to have a group of people who all like the same game, and you have to be able to get the group together regularly to play it. There are plenty of people who are interested, but I suspect that the vast majority of them are already players of whatever game they favor (if they haven't switched to something like World of Warcraft--see below), so I don't know that there's a lot of untapped market share.

As for getting the group together to play, when all of the players are teenagers in school or college, that's relatively easy. It gets a lot harder when people are adults and have to work, pay mortgages, deal with various curve balls that adult life always throws at you, etc. And if you know you're not going to be able to devote the time to it that you used to as a kid when you learned the games (I started playing D&D in eighth grade, and spent far more hours playing it between then and graduating from high school than I have in all the years since--and my 40 year high school reunion is this year), it gets a lot harder to justify spending money on game materials.

Another factor is the availability of online games like World of Warcraft, which I mentioned above. These games solve the time and interest problem in a way that can't help scaling much better than in person tabletop play: you can play from your computer at home and there are always other people online playing. There are also limitations, of course: for example, you can't make up your own adventures and you can't have house rules, which were both features of every D&D campaign I have ever encountered. But it's another factor that I think tends to limit the size of the available market for games like D&D.

All of the above factors seem to me to indicate that there is a natural limit to the size of the market for games like the ones WoTC is producing, and the actual active market is close to that limiting size. If that's true, then the option of trying to make more money by scaling instead of markup simply isn't available to them.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#122
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's only so much water in the well, though, and they might well be close to that limit. It's not an infinitely growable market, it's a niche product. True, the niche has gotten quite large in recent years, but at this point it's at least as likely to shrink as to grow.

> It's not an infinitely growable market This needs to be said more often about more markets.

One would think that it would be true of pretty much _any _ market. I know it's not being meant literally, but even so, there are only so many people in the world, and people only have so much money. Even something that's essential for everyone like food is going to be limited by that; eventually you'd need to wait for there to be more people if you want to be able to sell more.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#123
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might be that they are out of touch but there is another very sensible reason for all this. They view D&D as extremely under-monetized (pretty reasonable, they don't make much off each player on average) and they have a huge influx of new fans and interest. So why does everyone assume they care about the existing fans, who don't give them money, so much? Maybe they just decided they don't care, they'll get new fan…

That was certainly their gamble... and it clearly didn't work. The problem for WotC is that Dungeon Masters (DMs) are the decision-makers for the playerbase. DMs are higher information consumers than players. They are the ones looking up obscure 3rd party homebrew fixes for issues inherent in 5e's design. They are the ones memorizing hundreds of pages of rules _for fun_. And if your DM says, "I'm going to switch us o…

> The problem for WotC is that Dungeon Masters (DMs) are the decision-makers for the playerbase.

DMs are higher information consumers than players.

I think this is a very important point to recognize. The proper market unit for a game like D&D is the play group, led by the DM, not the individual player.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#124
post #48

A bit more context: * Wizards of the Coast (WoTC) has been tasked by Hasbro (which owns WoTC) to drastically increase profits over a few years. * WoTC has been aggressively increasing prices on Magic the Gathering (MTG) and drastically increased the diversity of products. This overwhelmed even people who follow and produce MTG news. Wallet fatique is rampant and people are disgruntled. * WoTC releases the 30th aniver…

Just turn the tap until blood comes out.

> Don't mess with Dungeon Masters who know how to call together a group of people

Don't mess with Dungeon Masters who have converted their campaign into 2 seasons on Amazon Prime. Just sit back and collect the checks for the free advertising.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#125
All of the tumult of the past few weeks has been fun, and, just what D&D needed. If Wizards had been savvier (or more malicious) they would have pulled back on the OGL little by little.

I’ve been following the OGL since its release back when I was a a broke HS kid obsessed with the idea of Free Software. I even had a (very) short conversation with Richard Stallman about it “it’s good enough for a game.” I didn’t agree.

This is great, and, completely expected if you know anything about the people involved.

Being able to publish anything you want and still make use of the SRD is a great thing for D&D.. But I still kinda hoped they’d blow it up so we’d get a bloom of new systems. Whatever, at least publishers are more likely to move away from OGL-like licenses and over to CC now.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#126
post #48

A bit more context: * Wizards of the Coast (WoTC) has been tasked by Hasbro (which owns WoTC) to drastically increase profits over a few years. * WoTC has been aggressively increasing prices on Magic the Gathering (MTG) and drastically increased the diversity of products. This overwhelmed even people who follow and produce MTG news. Wallet fatique is rampant and people are disgruntled. * WoTC releases the 30th aniver…

> The real problem is the managers at WoTC that don't really care about the games. They only care about money. I expect more bad things in the future. The same seems to be true with Games Workshop and I've never understood this. The products from both companies have huge markups (painted cards and pieces of plastic) and I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale…

Most products start off fueled by passion and love, but once the original masterminds move on the people left are the beancounters who are more interested in the fruits of the product rather than the product itself.

We see this happen basically everywhere with almost no exceptions.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#127
WotC does not own the concept of elves, dwarves, or dragons. Nor the concept of dice.

D&D is a strong franchise, but the merchandise and rulesets are hardly necessary to play the game.

To play RPGs, even practically-D&D-in-all-but-name, all you need is dice and paper.

Nerds are wont to roll their own.

I may not be a regular guest feature in the HBR, but it seems like common sense even to me that this is a strategically, financially dangerous path to take given their customer base.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#128
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the company that once sold an ancient Roman weapon of war (plumbata) as children’s toy. At least one child died when hit by the dart. The company should be shut down and its valuable brands spun off!

Unrelated to DnD, but I still have a 2002 email from Alan Hassenfeld the former CEO of Hasbro (HASsenfeld BROthers) in reply to my sending my protest of them moving factories to China. (I know, kind of quaint/futile in hindsight)

> I know, kind of quaint/futile in hindsight

It's not at all quaint and futile; don't believe that crap, meant to shut you up. It's awesome you sent that email.

It's futile if your standard is that, as just one person, you will achieve 100% success. Then everything in the world is futile, because nobody ever accomplishes anything significant alone (really - name anyone doing anything) or 100%. (Let's realize also that it would be wrong if one person had that much power. There are others with legitimate, conflicting interests, who should have a 'vote' too.)

But you are part of a larger community, and I promise Hasbro listens to the signals. If they switched manufacturing to China and there was silence, that would be a powerful signal. If all they heard was their shareholders or Wall Street analysts, that would be a powerful signal.

It's not all or nothing, the same goes for most other issues (such as elections). People shift positions based on the response. Maybe less work was shifted to China, then or on a future date; maybe they decided to keep customer service in the US or make the investment more flexible or short term. Maybe they mentioned at Davos, 'wow, we sure heard a lot of complaints about moving the manufacturing', and others heard it and shifted their positions.

Keep talking; the people who say it's futile are the people who want you to shut up.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#129
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real problem is the managers at WoTC that don't really care about the games. They only care about money. I expect more bad things in the future. The same seems to be true with Games Workshop and I've never understood this. The products from both companies have huge markups (painted cards and pieces of plastic) and I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale…

> I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale rather than treating their products as luxury items I'm not sure that's true. The actual bottleneck with these games is not money but time and interest: you have to have a group of people who all like the same game, and you have to be able to get the group together regularly to play it. There are plenty of people who a…

I’m still holding out hope I’ll be able to have a D&D renneisance after I retire (or maybe when the kids are old enough).

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#130
post #129
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale rather than treating their products as luxury items I'm not sure that's true. The actual bottleneck with these games is not money but time and interest: you have to have a group of people who all like the same game, and you have to be able to get the group together regularly to play it. There are plenty of people who a…

I’m still holding out hope I’ll be able to have a D&D renneisance after I retire (or maybe when the kids are old enough).

I've had the same thoughts. :-)
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