I’ve learned in my career to have no concern for the big picture as I will have another job before it is my problem.
Let the building burn down. Let the fires burn. By the time the fire reaches where I sit, I’ll be gone.
Story: “It would be career limiting..."
121–130 of 342 posts
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, it seems like scope needed to be reduced in order to deliver an MVP on time.
It seems like Agile would have been a great fit. Too many requirements, no real information - it's exactly the situation where throwing out prototypes and getting feedback can lead to a solution.
Agile is great for running execution teams and gives you real-time feedback on progress, but if you have a contract with fixed scope and timeline, you're just boxed in. Agile requires flexibility on time and/or scope and it's not amenable to a services contract unless you have a very trusting customer.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#123Yeah, that was probably a setup for failure.
It's not unlikely to think that management already knew what you found out before your report. they just used stalling tactics.
In the end you did the right thing to leave the project. These projects are commonly referred to as "death march projects" [Yourdon, Edward] and you should learn to identify them before joining.
I learned about CLMs early in my career: career limiting moves. It is something you need to avoid. Pick you battles and try to avoid imploding of frustration when things are becoming really bad. Just make sure you CYA and do basic stakeholder management to protect your reputation and skillset.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#124I mean this story is cathartic, but I don't get what the "rabble rousers" expected to happen. You don't go into a meeting like that to present problems, but to present solutions. And a 12 month delay on a $60 million contract isn't a solution, it's another problem for the sales/client success people. And doing it in front of a group of management, no less - that's like firing a shot across the bow, declaring that the…
The lesson for engineers is that it is better to fail than try to lead.
Should have just arrived at the handoff with a half finished project and a new job offer, leaving the business types with the mess.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#125I mean this story is cathartic, but I don't get what the "rabble rousers" expected to happen. You don't go into a meeting like that to present problems, but to present solutions. And a 12 month delay on a $60 million contract isn't a solution, it's another problem for the sales/client success people. And doing it in front of a group of management, no less - that's like firing a shot across the bow, declaring that the…
Bad news like this should probably be first communicated up to management privately, not sprung upon them in a meeting in front of their peers and reports.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#126Earlier quoted context omitted.
> concoct a plan to stage the product development and release such that it gets done and you don't cost a giant contract Yes, always showing up with a solution to problems that you've surfaced is a good idea and good for your career, ... BUT: isn't coming up with a solution to this problem literally the job of the management team that they presented to? If management hears "the thing you think will happen will absolu…
Suppose you were a junior engineer working with a senior engineer. They gave you a task, and you came to a similar conclusion: it was their job to do X, but they weren't doing it. Would you simply tell them they're not doing their job, or would you ask questions, talk in private, and try to dig in tactfully? When I was 22 or so, I did go around telling a certain senior engineer that they weren't doing their job. I st…
Some of what you said is true, but your analog is a little off. It wasn’t a junior and a senior in the same role, it was a technical team deputized to do what they did, and a management group that apparently thought the deputies would fail, or convinced themselves their conclusions were wrong.
The failure here is not one of lack of politics or communication on the part of the author or their team, but on the culture of the management team. Why invite that presentation if all it does is publicly humiliate your PMs?
Could the deputies have done more? How is amateur politicking by technical contributors perceived at your place of work?
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#127I mean this story is cathartic, but I don't get what the "rabble rousers" expected to happen. You don't go into a meeting like that to present problems, but to present solutions. And a 12 month delay on a $60 million contract isn't a solution, it's another problem for the sales/client success people. And doing it in front of a group of management, no less - that's like firing a shot across the bow, declaring that the…
And that's how the Challenger blew up. Sometimes one side is right, and the other side is wrong, and it doesn't matter if they didn't "communicate and strategize" or "read the room". Obviously this guy is probably writing about a Javascript photo-sharing app or something and it doesn't actually matter, but it's the same principle. The managers who went ahead here would have gone ahead with launching the shuttle for t…
I think your comment actually supports the original comment. If what's at stake is a $60M javascript photo-sharing app, then you gotta decide how much you care to massage egos and play the game.
If you're literally putting human lives at risk and you think there's a real chance of death, what a petty thing to say, "Oh well they should've just listened! It's a high-stakes game!" Do be clear, this doesn't shift the responsibility but it just reinforces that if you want to just raise a stink—do it however you think best. If you want to communicate effectively, you must play by the laws of human ego. Plain and simple.
People always underestimate the allure of human ego and pride.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#128> I spent about 18 months working on a doomed project. For a lot of that time, I thought I was the only one who realized it was doomed. I had a similar feeling about a project once. I thought "Boy is this stupid. No one in their right mind is going to pay for this. Why are we building this." Let me manager know my feelings. Stayed and built it. Thing is a huge success. One of our best selling products. Boy do I still…
It sounds like you were working on the project without enough contact with users to understand the value of the thing you were building. That doesn't sound like it's your fault!
If the only thing between business failure and business success was contact with users, there’d be a lot fewer failed businesses.
Sometimes you just don’t see it, and that’s ok. Not everything is “I would have succeeded if only…”
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#129I mean this story is cathartic, but I don't get what the "rabble rousers" expected to happen. You don't go into a meeting like that to present problems, but to present solutions. And a 12 month delay on a $60 million contract isn't a solution, it's another problem for the sales/client success people. And doing it in front of a group of management, no less - that's like firing a shot across the bow, declaring that the…
I've personally done this exact thing. If the project is underestimated, there isn't always a solution. I worked on a smaller project for an agency where I was the tech director. Meaning I had a direct line to clients and account managers at all times as well as authority over the execution. I raised flags when the contract was drafted that it was vague and optimistic, but it got signed anyway. I did a prioritization…
Better approach is to leave.
Talking to those kind of ppl is like playing chess with pigeon.
Just dont, have dignity. We are some of the smartest ppl this earth is supporting.
Re: Story: “It would be career limiting..."
#130When I was younger I thought I was smart when I would point out an organization's dysfunction. Now I think the smart thing is to figure out how to be effective in dysfunction, which is everywhere at some level.
Working in dysfunction wears me down. To me Dilbert is funny for the first 10 strips or so, then it becomes dull and depressing. My way is to try to get small victories against dysfunction. When I stop getting these, I start seeking for another dysfunction elsewhere.