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Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

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Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#121

Post by koheripbal »

mherdeg wrote: post #94
seydor wrote: post #43

I wish this whole saga ended, and Musk buys reddit instead. This current saga is pure entertainment, which will end up in some kind of settlement and will leave the lawyers a lot richer.

I'm amazed by how reddit has turned itself around from "the place where the commenter zeitgeist involves wishing physical violence on the CEO" to "the place I append to all my searches with a site: prefix to find meaningful Web discussion and product reviews". There was a surprising and unpredictable community turnaround from about 2015-2021; don't know if it will last, but it's surprising how much better it is now.

I use it for product reviews, but don't ever use it for meaningful discussions. The average age of Reddit users has dropped significantly since the mobile app launched.

For tech solutions, Stackexchange is the place to go.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#122

Post by spywaregorilla »

benj111 wrote: post #77
mywittyname wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This provides a lot of insight into how that man got to the top. He clearly has no qualms about lying and bullshitting his way into and out of anything and no amount of proof to the contrary will ever get him to admit he was wrong. I guess this is similar to the "reality distortion field" people claim Jobs had. Except the examples given there were more of him not believing people who said something couldn't be done.

I reach the opposite conclusion. He offers to buy twitter on a whim, then changes his mind after signing a contract. That doesn't really seem like a good way of getting to the top.

People are missing the obvious story. He locked himself into a price, then the price of things crashed. It has crashed so much that he's honestly better off just walking away and losing the billion dollars... but he doesn't want to lose a billion dollars so he's gonna do whatever he can do to get out of it.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#123

Post by iasay »

dragontamer wrote: post #118
jjeaff wrote: post #105

Imagine this whole ordeal playing out on a house that was not listed for sale. The buyer starts harassing the homeowner to sell to them, they say no, so he buys up the mortgage lender and tries to force a sale. His antics are hurting the home's value so you relent to selling and give him an as-is sale contract, which he signs and gives you 24 hrs to respond or he will try to force a sale. All the while, this is of co…

> Who could possibly be on the side of the buyer? Except you can just buy up supporters by gaslighting huge masses of people on Twitter. The house in question. Its so ridiculous. Musk's popularity is largely *BECAUSE* of his Twitter antics. So this "buyer" is basically someone who has come to house-parties / benefited from the house in question for the last decade. And the people arguing against the (current owners)…

If his popularity is due to what he posts on twitter it would appear that a large proportion of the human race are deranged morons.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#124

Post by nojito »

hartator wrote: post #74

"Twitter also ties mDAU goals to executive compensation. In 2020 Twitter based its executives’ cash bonus pool on revenue, operating income, and adjusted EBITDA. After Twitter missed those targets in 2020, and only 32% of the cash bonus pool was funded, Twitter determined that mDAU (a highly manipulable number) should be considered in determining whether executives received these bonuses. Following that change, in 20…

None of that matters when he waived due diligence.

Again all of that information is public knowledge through twitter's SEC filings.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#125

Post by leobg »

jcranmer wrote: post #8

I think Musk's counterclaims are more interesting than Twitter's response. Here's the summary of the five counterclaims: * Twitter committed fraud by lying to the SEC about the mDAU numbers with the intent of inducing Musk to buy Twitter at an inflated price. No, really, this is the allegation (see paragraphs 202-206). * Count 2 is that Twitter committed [Texas fraud statute] by lying when it offered its shares. It's…

> arguing that Twitter lied about its numbers for years specifically so that someone would buy it at an inflated price?

I don’t think that’s the argument. Twitter is an ad supported business. As such, the incentive is to count the “monthly active users” rather higher than lower. Specifically, there us no incentive to make an effort to exclude automated accounts from that number at all.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#126

Post by pcmoney »

hunterb123 wrote: post #112
jjeaff wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have seen no credible evidence that Twitter is wrong about their numbers. Nor do I even see any possible way an outsider could figure that number out.

Have you seen credible evidence that they are right about their numbers? Without Twitter providing more context and showing their work, the number can't be trusted, thus it isn't credible. If you claim you have such a low number of bots (5%), you better prove it, otherwise I'll assume the worst and go with 20%. Anyone that goes on Twitter knows it's above 5%. All 3rd party estimations are well above 5%. Prove it Twit…

They literally never claimed this was accurate and even said their methodology could be wrong. Nothing in the contract says anything about bots. They don’t have to prove anything at all.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#127

Post by bostonsre »

zinekeller wrote: post #18
jcranmer wrote: post #8

I think Musk's counterclaims are more interesting than Twitter's response. Here's the summary of the five counterclaims: * Twitter committed fraud by lying to the SEC about the mDAU numbers with the intent of inducing Musk to buy Twitter at an inflated price. No, really, this is the allegation (see paragraphs 202-206). * Count 2 is that Twitter committed [Texas fraud statute] by lying when it offered its shares. It's…

> Twitter committed fraud by lying to the SEC about the mDAU numbers with the intent of inducing Musk to buy Twitter at an inflated price. What is that commonly-used aphorism? "One man's trash is another man's treasure"? Like, even if this is true , Musk didn't do (and subsequently waived) due diligence. > No, really, this is the allegation No further comment on it. > Count 2 is that Twitter committed [Texas fraud st…

> Musk didn't do (and subsequently waived) due diligence.

Wasn't him collecting all of this MAU stuff to analyze it part of the due diligence needed in order to close the deal?

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#128

Post by EdiX »

AllegedAlec wrote: post #30

I'm still convinced he's just gonna use it to suggest that a judge should meet him in the middle; make him buy the company, but use the allegations of large numbers of bots to reduce the price.

The funny thing is that stalling is probably enough to pay less. He's partially financing the operation by selling tesla stocks, if the market goes back up and takes tesla stock price up with it then buying twitter will cost less money.

My opinion is this is just a stalling tactic, he thinks the market will recover by next year and this is a pretext to wait until then.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#129

Post by pcmoney »

pcmoney wrote: post #6

Musk seems like a smart guy who got overconfident and out of his area of expertise and made a series of incredibly stupid decisions. Pretty much every legal and financial professional without a vested Musk related interest seems to think similarly. Matt Levine has been lights out on this topic. Everyone knows his bot claims are just FUD to try and weasel out of writing a check he no longer has the guts to cash with c…

By the downvotes it Looks like musk fan boys cant handle their lord and savior being called out for making a series of dumb decisions.

Re: Twitter says Musk’s spam analysis used tool that called his own account a bot

#130

Post by metadat »

matwood wrote: post #103
ncallaway wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think there’s any world where that happens. I think a judge would either order specific performance (e.g. do the thing the contract says, as specified in the contract), or we’re talking about damages (e.g. pay Twitter $X, but you don’t get anything in return). I think a purchase at a lower price would probably only come from a settlement between the parties, and… I think that’s likely. Twitter didn’t want to…

I agree there won't be any meet in the middle. Neither Musk nor Twitter want Musk to own Twitter now though. What's happening today is negotiating the break up fee which starts at the difference between current market cap and 54B (~22B today). The accelerated trial date put Musk on notice. The SEC may not take enforcing the rules seriously, but Delaware has made it their business to enforce the rules that make it att…

Why settle for only $10B? Musk's shenanigans have resulted in significant long-term damage to Twitter in the form uncertainty and distracting Twitter from focusing on operating and growing the business (because they've changed internal policies / direction, and shared a lot of information with Musk, as per the acquisition agreement).

It's only fair for mullosk to be on the hook for the full purchase or at the very least the full differential.

We'll see what happens in about two months.

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