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Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

legends.solar

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Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#121

Post by sanxiyn »

yepnopemaybe wrote: post #37
spinaltap wrote: post #8

At the end of the day, it all comes down to ROI. If this had a good ROI, it probably already attracted enough investors without needing to create such a investment product. If not, then I might as well buy SP500.

It might be useful to think of Legends Solar panels as a kind of fixed income security. It depreciates over time but produces a steady stream of dividends. Significantly lower risk than the stock market, but with somewhat predictable returns. The important thing we hope to capture is the experience... it'll feel much more like owning a consumer product than an investment.

It sounds more like real estate investment than fixed income security. You get electricity instead of rent.

Similarities include physical depreciation, need for maintenance, insurance, importance of location, vacancy risk (vs bad weather), tenant risk (vs power customer), how each case is special snowflake, etc.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#123

Post by sanxiyn »

arcticbull wrote: post #32
foobiekr wrote: post #26

This is basically a variation on the SolarCity business model, but focusing on commercial properties. There is probably a business here, but not one that tries to recruit individual investors because it will only be profitable at scale, and the kind of financial backing needed to do this is available to qualified teams. The recruiting individuals thing is basically an admission that this team does not have access to…

I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…

I think REIT is better comparison. I agree large investors are better, but that does not mean small investors are worthless.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#125

Post by kumarvvr »

halffaday wrote: post #124

I wasn’t under the impression that solar panels actually generate more revenue in their service life than their production and installation costs. Has this changed in the last few years?

Most Solar installations have Break even at about 7 - 10 years from date of operation.

Useful life of panels, i.e, years required for their output to fall to 80% of full output is in the range of 20-25 years.

After the break even period, most of the cash flow is profit.

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#128

Post by qiqitori »

foobiekr wrote: post #52
arcticbull wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…

No one in their right mind wants to build a pseudo-investment company dealing with tons of small investors in the few hundreds of dollars to few thousands of dollars range. The only thing missing here is a crypto coin. If they really have a business model that can yield 8+% annual, assuming they get a cut, then they would raise real capital and not deal with randos. They don’t.

There's quite a few companies doing this where I live (Japan), e.g., https://change-x.jp/equipment. One important clause I saw was that the ownership of the panels automatically transfers back to the operating company after the panel's useful lifespan (defined to be 20 years). I also saw an example that originally did small investors but then at some point found a large investor, but can't remember their name at the moment.

Similarly, what do you think about the fact that solar panel manufacturers and all inbetweeners could "just" build their own power plants rather than sell to individuals?

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#129

Post by nitsuaeekcm »

You can’t join unless you’re an accredited investor. That’s because, like for many other fun similar things, the enterprise passes the Howey Test and is considered a security under the Securities Act of 1933.

It’s funny how they try to disclose-away the problem at the bottom, even though they’re obviously worried about it enough to block retail investors (if a security only sells to accredited investors, you can basically do whatever you want.)

https://www.uclalawreview.org/here-comes-the-sun-how-securit...

Re: Legends Solar – Buy operating solar panels on commercial solar farms

#130

Post by [deleted] »

yepnopemaybe wrote: post #54
arcticbull wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see, your argument is that like (for instance) LendingClub, the economies of scale always favor large investors, and that this platform simply cannot get large investors onboard. That may be due to a lack of connections, or due to some other potential fundamental issues with the business model. At the end of the day if the business is sound it makes more sense to target fewer large investors - not many, smaller one…

What we are doing is super simple. Equity ownership in real, operating solar panels. There is nothing particularly synthetic or structured about these investments (i.e. like BNPL, etc.) We need enough scale to move a large (20M+) facility, but beyond that scale will only help insofar as bringing on follow on investments and referrals becomes a bit easier. We may also do some institutional stuff, but for the time bein…

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